EV Digest 6216
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: regen braking
by "Peter VanDerWal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: 3 Wheelers WAS Re: [BULK] Re: A different kind of EV video :) .. 3
wheeler EV .. stability issues
by David Dymaxion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Re: winter vacation and EV
by "Peter VanDerWal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: copy of PB-6
by Bill & Nancy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: [BULK] Re: A different kind of EV video :) .. 3 wheeler EV ..
stability issues
by "Mark McCurdy" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Dual Motor Coupler / AC55
by Matthew Drobnak <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Re: HHO? any one know more about this?
by "Michael Perry" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) Re: If I only need a 5 mile range ... really
by "Roderick Wilde" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Re: OT. Changing the value of a wound resistor.
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: OT. Changing the value of a wound resistor.
by <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Re: 3 Wheelers WAS Re: [BULK] Re: A different kind of EV video
:) .. 3 wheeler EV .. stability issues
by "Peter VanDerWal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Re: FW: Newbie - NiMH vs VRLA pack choice
by Jack Murray <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Re: FW: Newbie - NiMH vs VRLA pack choice
by "Edward Ang" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re: FW: Newbie - NiMH vs VRLA pack choice
by Jack Murray <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) RE: If I only need a 5 mile range ... really
by Cor van de Water <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) RE: OT. Changing the value of a wound resistor.
by Cor van de Water <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: If I only need a 5 mile range ... really
by Cory Cross <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Re: If I only need a 5 mile range ... really
by "Roderick Wilde" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Re: FW: Newbie - NiMH vs VRLA pack choice
by Ray Wong <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) Fw: Good News....this is interesting
by GWMobile <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Re: HHO? any one know more about this?
by Danny Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) Re: Galvanization
by Dave Cover <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
> the only thing i've seen is the following, and the folks selling it said
> you would only get about 3% back from it?
>
Sounds about right, depending on your local terain and driving conditions,
Somewhere between zero and 5-10%.
FWIW if you are planning on using a series wound motor, regen is probably
not worth the money.
If you are willing to spend the extra money, AC or Brushless DC is a
better option for regen. Of course this assumes you have a driving
pattern that can benifit from regen (frequent stops or hills)
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If you send email to me, or the EVDL, that has > 4 lines of legalistic
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--- Begin Message ---
Correction on the last post: Claims the theoretical tip-over point is 3 g, but
it'll skid well before that.
----- Original Message ----
From: "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2006 6:17:07 PM
Subject: 3 Wheelers WAS Re: [BULK] Re: A different kind of EV video :) .. 3
wheeler EV .. stability issues
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lawrence Lile" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2006 6:55 PM
Subject: RE: [BULK] Re: A different kind of EV video :) .. 3 wheeler EV ..
stability issues
>
> In the experiments we've done with 3 wheel bicycles, (yes, some of them
> were EV's) you definitely want the two wheels in front for cornering.
> If you are turning and braking, then a three wheeler with one wheel in
> front goes right over on it's side. I'm skeptical of all the commercial
> 3-wheeler EV's out there. The steering wheels need to be in front, a
> rear steer vehicle is possible but creates some interesting challenges.
>
>
>
> Lawrence Lile,
> Hi Lawrence, an" EVerybody;
I'll go along with Jerry Dycus as to the two wheels on a 3 wheeler gotta
go up front!In my tour of duties in the Orient I saw a lot of 3 wheelers.
Mazdas I think, that resemble the Zap 3 wheel truck. Hidiously overloaded
they trundled thrrough the street of Taipei and Saigon.( Gees! That dates
me) I never saw any overturned, but they don't drive like Americans, pushing
the limit of EVery vehicle!I saw a Zap a few months ago, asked the guy he
said it turned over too easy, or something to that effect. it would appear
to defy the laws of physics, like 300MPH plus Top Fuel Cars, when you try to
bend it around a corner? Of course it will want to roll! I don't think there
are ANY 3 wheel hiway worthy one- in-front cars?? Flame suit on, tell me IF
there are? There are 3 wheel Trikes, motorcycles, but not many cars.I think
that with the batteries properly placed in a 3 wheeler, it will handle
beautifully? Jerry D? The real wheel is just providing the push, not
steering. It would seem like alota work to make the REAR wheel steer, you
would haftas use the front as a power axle, Guess it would work?
My two Wheels worth
Bob
__________________________________________________
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Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
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--- Begin Message ---
Clean them, charge them, and let them sit. 3 weeks won't hurt them.
They might take a couple days to come back up to full performance when you
get back (mostly because they will be cold)
.
> Thanks for the help on the heater and hall effect pedal. I guess I'm
> looking for some reassurance for many things.
>
> Here's another one. I'm going out of country for 3 weeks (winter time).
> I don't have a heated garage (but its better than no garage)
>
> So, my choices are (for the Trojan batteries)
> 1 leave the car on the Zivan float charge all 3 weeks.
> 2 Have a friend unplug and replug the Zivan 3 times.
> 3 Unplug the car for 3 weeks.
> 4 If I can trust him, have my friend who isn't fond of electric cars drive
> it once per week and plug it in (and hope he doesn't damage anything)
>
> My only EV friend who I would have trusted this task to is out of state
> also.
>
> Ben
>
>
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If you send email to me, or the EVDL, that has > 4 lines of legalistic
junk at the end; then you are specifically authorizing me to do whatever I
wish with the message. By posting the message you agree that your long
legalistic signature is void.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I bought one and it had the full resistance range, measured with ohmeter
went from 0 to a little over 5k. It worked ok when I tested it with my
motor controller setup in my GTE, haven't had it on the road yet though.
Bill
Joseph H. Strubhar wrote:
Has anyone used or know anything about this potbox? Supposed to be a direct
replacement made in India.
ebay # 150070853551
Joseph H. Strubhar
E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Web: www.gremcoinc.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
if anyone's driven a forklift, they've noticed that vehicles that steer from
the rear are easy to lose control of.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lawrence Lile" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2006 5:55 PM
Subject: RE: [BULK] Re: A different kind of EV video :) .. 3 wheeler EV ..
stability issues
In the experiments we've done with 3 wheel bicycles, (yes, some of them
were EV's) you definitely want the two wheels in front for cornering.
If you are turning and braking, then a three wheeler with one wheel in
front goes right over on it's side. I'm skeptical of all the commercial
3-wheeler EV's out there. The steering wheels need to be in front, a
rear steer vehicle is possible but creates some interesting challenges.
Lawrence Lile,
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of peekay
Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2006 10:52 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [BULK] Re: A different kind of EV video :) .. 3 wheeler EV ..
stability issues
Importance: Low
hi nikki .. that was quick .. the response i mean
(btw, you look very professional in the video)
i have been tinkering with this 3 wheel idea for
a long time .. the steering is usually done by the
one wheel .. but placing the two wheels in the
front should be more "stable" when turning
..peekay
----- Original Message -----
From: "nikki" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2006 8:25 PM
Subject: Re: A different kind of EV video :)
Well, the Mini EL is pretty stable - but I see where you're going.
The only fault I'd give the El in terms of stability is the way it
really badly under-steers if you take a corner too fast. Because it's
only 3 and a half feet wide you can normally get away with it (you
get used to going in a corner low and coming out high)
There are of course some EVs that are the other way around (2+1) but
I think they steer from the front. I'm sure someone will correct me
if I'm wrong ;)
<snipped>
Nikki.
On 14 Dec 2006, at 13:44, peekay wrote:
> very nice
>
> ..peekay
>
> (if one makes a 3wheeled ev, would it be more
> stable if the 2 wheels are up front and the 1 wheel
> is at the rear .. steering still would be by that one
> wheel at the rear .. shd be more stable)
>
___________________________________________________________
All new Yahoo! Mail "The new Interface is stunning in its simplicity and
ease of use." - PC Magazine
http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi all. I'm looking into the Solectria AC55 based system (RFE
drivetrain) that was posted on the EVDL a few days ago. Two questions:
How much do you think the dual motor setup is worth?
Who can create a coupler to couple it to the input shaft of a transmission?
I figure between that system, and the NiMH battery info that was posted
a few weeks ago...It'd make a nice conversion for me. :-)
Thanks,
-Matt
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Per a previous search, it lead me to believe they may be storing both gases
in the same tank. That could be interesting... if viewed from a few blocks
away.
BTW, if he's injecting H2 (or H2 & O) into an engine, it should make for
more power and better fuel economy. It's just another fuel... and one that
would burn clean. I wouldn't want to drive around w/ a tank full of mixed
gases, however. It could make life short but interesting.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tim Gamber" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2006 3:50 PM
Subject: RE: HHO? any one know more about this?
> In the video it did not look like something new and revolutionary at all,
it
> just looked like he was burning hydrogen gas. H2 Each hydrogen is bonded
> with one other molecule making a somewhat stable molocule. When 2 moles of
> H2 gas reacts with 1 mole of O2 gas (oxygen) it forms 2 moles of water
> 2(H2O). This makes alot of sense.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
A wag would be about 15 miles of fun. These are very low internal resistance
batteries and will not sag much so you will have good performance. Just be
careful with charging as they are sealed AGMs. Learn everything you can
about caring for these batteries. Your top available speed will be over
double what you listed you need.
Roderick Wilde
EV Parts, Inc.
www.evparts.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Powers" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2006 7:13 PM
Subject: If I only need a 5 mile range ... really
In my Festiva, ADC 9" motor, 400 A Curtis controller, I only need a max 5
mile range (its about 3.8 miles round trip). I want to lighten the car up
and save some money at the same time when I replace the pack.
If I put 10 of these in, do you think I could reliably get the 5 miles.
http://www.surpluscenter.com/item.asp?UID=2006121421031663&item=11-3096&catname=
That's only 120 V x 54 AH ... not much at all ... maybe a usable 5kWh.
Speeds are as follows:
~.5 miles - 25 MPH
~1 mile - 40 MPH
~.5 miles - 30 MPH
each way
4 - 5 stop signs / lights
all flat roads
Other ideas ...
Steve
---------------------------------
Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail beta.
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Checked by AVG Free Edition.
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--- Begin Message ---
There is a float that must pass up and down the windings. I can't block it
with anything. It's now 500 ohms. I was wondering if I just soldered the
windings together on every other winding if that will reduce the resistance?
It seems that it would be a very accurate way of reducing the ohms to 240.
That's the only way to do it without redoing the whole thing. It's a float
assembly for a Peugeot diesel tank sender which I'm using for vegetable oil.
The only other thing I can think of is to wind my own or buy a float and
adjust it to work with the Peugeot tank. Lawrence Rhodes....
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom Carpenter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2006 6:51 PM
Subject: Re: OT. Changing the value of a wound resistor.
> If you have two of these just parallel them.
>
>
> Tom
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[email protected]>
> Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2006 8:51 PM
> Subject: OT. Changing the value of a wound resistor.
>
>
> >I have an 8 inch wound risistor that is 500 ohms. I need a 250 ohm
> >resistor
> > of the same length. Can I insert solder between the windings to reduce
> > the
> > resistance of the resistor untill I have the resistance I want? The
> > resistance must still change gradually up and down the length of the
> > resistor. Lawrence Rhodes.........
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > No virus found in this incoming message.
> > Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> > Version: 7.1.409 / Virus Database: 268.15.19/587 - Release Date:
> > 12/14/2006
> >
> >
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I'm guessing that there are 3 leads from this unit making a variable
resistor. What about a parallel 500 ohm resistor from the "bottom" end of
the current unit to the float lead. This would affect the linearity some,
but should make the range from 0-250 as the float moved from bottom to top,
at least by my simple math anyway.
respectfully,
John
58 Harley Servicar "The Skunk"
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2006 8:48 PM
Subject: Re: OT. Changing the value of a wound resistor.
There is a float that must pass up and down the windings. I can't block
it
with anything. It's now 500 ohms. I was wondering if I just soldered the
windings together on every other winding if that will reduce the
resistance?
It seems that it would be a very accurate way of reducing the ohms to 240.
That's the only way to do it without redoing the whole thing. It's a
float
assembly for a Peugeot diesel tank sender which I'm using for vegetable
oil.
The only other thing I can think of is to wind my own or buy a float and
adjust it to work with the Peugeot tank. Lawrence Rhodes....
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom Carpenter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2006 6:51 PM
Subject: Re: OT. Changing the value of a wound resistor.
If you have two of these just parallel them.
Tom
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2006 8:51 PM
Subject: OT. Changing the value of a wound resistor.
>I have an 8 inch wound risistor that is 500 ohms. I need a 250 ohm
>resistor
> of the same length. Can I insert solder between the windings to reduce
> the
> resistance of the resistor untill I have the resistance I want? The
> resistance must still change gradually up and down the length of the
> resistor. Lawrence Rhodes.........
>
>
>
> --
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.1.409 / Virus Database: 268.15.19/587 - Release Date:
> 12/14/2006
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Where did you get the 3G lateral from? The add says 1G. I've never even
heard of tires that could provide 3G lateral.
> <http://www.vigillante.com/vigillante1.htm>
>
> One wheel in front, and claims to do 3 lateral g, and be very stable under
> heavy breaking.
>
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: [email protected]
> Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2006 6:17:07 PM
> Subject: 3 Wheelers WAS Re: [BULK] Re: A different kind of EV video :)
> .. 3 wheeler EV .. stability issues
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Lawrence Lile" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[email protected]>
> Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2006 6:55 PM
> Subject: RE: [BULK] Re: A different kind of EV video :) .. 3 wheeler EV ..
> stability issues
>
>
>>
>> In the experiments we've done with 3 wheel bicycles, (yes, some of them
>> were EV's) you definitely want the two wheels in front for cornering.
>> If you are turning and braking, then a three wheeler with one wheel in
>> front goes right over on it's side. I'm skeptical of all the commercial
>> 3-wheeler EV's out there. The steering wheels need to be in front, a
>> rear steer vehicle is possible but creates some interesting challenges.
>>
>>
>>
>> Lawrence Lile,
>> Hi Lawrence, an" EVerybody;
>
> I'll go along with Jerry Dycus as to the two wheels on a 3 wheeler
> gotta
> go up front!In my tour of duties in the Orient I saw a lot of 3 wheelers.
> Mazdas I think, that resemble the Zap 3 wheel truck. Hidiously overloaded
> they trundled thrrough the street of Taipei and Saigon.( Gees! That dates
> me) I never saw any overturned, but they don't drive like Americans,
> pushing
> the limit of EVery vehicle!I saw a Zap a few months ago, asked the guy he
> said it turned over too easy, or something to that effect. it would appear
> to defy the laws of physics, like 300MPH plus Top Fuel Cars, when you try
> to
> bend it around a corner? Of course it will want to roll! I don't think
> there
> are ANY 3 wheel hiway worthy one- in-front cars?? Flame suit on, tell me
> IF
> there are? There are 3 wheel Trikes, motorcycles, but not many cars.I
> think
> that with the batteries properly placed in a 3 wheeler, it will handle
> beautifully? Jerry D? The real wheel is just providing the push, not
> steering. It would seem like alota work to make the REAR wheel steer, you
> would haftas use the front as a power axle, Guess it would work?
>
> My two Wheels worth
>
> Bob
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ____________________________________________________________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail beta.
> http://new.mail.yahoo.com
>
>
--
If you send email to me, or the EVDL, that has > 4 lines of legalistic
junk at the end; then you are specifically authorizing me to do whatever I
wish with the message. By posting the message you agree that your long
legalistic signature is void.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
As far as I know nobody has uses NiMH batteries.
The D and F cell NiMH batteries commonly available are not suitable for
an EV because they have very limited discharge rates. Some of the newer
SubC batteries for R/C racing can discharge at high rates. They are
somewhat expensive and because of their capacity would require a lot of
them.
Intellect recently came out with a new D-cell 9Ah battery that performs
the same as their SubC R/C batteries with a 10C discharge rate (even 30C
with voltage sag), and I believe would be good for EV use.
Many, if not most, seem to disagree with me, or at least believe they
are too expensive. Many seem to be waiting for Lithium and believe that
Lithium batteries prices will be cut in half next month, and half again
the month after that, but even after that will still be more expensive
than these NiMH batteries.
So things HAVE changed in 12 years, the difference is people still use
lead-acid batteries, but now they complain about using them because
better options are available they can't or won't afford.
Hope that helps.
Jack
Dale Ulan wrote:
I'm designing the battery system for a small-car (Honda Civic or something
like it) EV that I'm planning on building. This will be using a brushless DC
motor, 144V, 25kW (peak) - I have two motors, so if it's too lethargic I can
put on the second motor and controller. Anyways, I was originally planning
on using either Optima Yellow-Tops (D34's or two strings of D51's) or maybe
the Excide 34XCD. While searching the archives, I found some references to
building a NiMH pack out of F or D cells. Has anyone here done it recently?
Would you recommend it? I need to keep the battery pack below about 250 kg
for the vehicle safety inspection here (can't exceed GVWR), and a range of
60km would be nice - a 10 to 15 kW*h pack would probably be fine. I worked
on an EV maybe 12 years ago, but it has been a while and things change in
that amount of time. Thanks!
Dale Ulan
Calgary, Alberta, Canada
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On 12/14/06, Jack Murray <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
As far as I know nobody has uses NiMH batteries.
Huh?! See www.airlabcorp.com
There are at least 3 EV's with D cell Nimh on the road today.
The D and F cell NiMH batteries commonly available are not suitable for
an EV because they have very limited discharge rates. Some of the newer
SubC batteries for R/C racing can discharge at high rates. They are
somewhat expensive and because of their capacity would require a lot of
them.
Intellect recently came out with a new D-cell 9Ah battery that performs
the same as their SubC R/C batteries with a 10C discharge rate (even 30C
with voltage sag), and I believe would be good for EV use.
Our supplier has tested these "super" Nimh cells at 30C. You really
do not want to do that. Cycle life is terrible and the cells
eventually swells and leaks. RC people do not care about cycle life.
They can just keep buying batteries every few months. We cannot
afford to do that.
Many, if not most, seem to disagree with me, or at least believe they
are too expensive. Many seem to be waiting for Lithium and believe that
Lithium batteries prices will be cut in half next month, and half again
the month after that, but even after that will still be more expensive
than these NiMH batteries.
So things HAVE changed in 12 years, the difference is people still use
lead-acid batteries, but now they complain about using them because
better options are available they can't or won't afford.
Hope that helps.
Jack
Dale Ulan wrote:
> I'm designing the battery system for a small-car (Honda Civic or something
> like it) EV that I'm planning on building. This will be using a brushless DC
> motor, 144V, 25kW (peak) - I have two motors, so if it's too lethargic I can
> put on the second motor and controller. Anyways, I was originally planning
> on using either Optima Yellow-Tops (D34's or two strings of D51's) or maybe
> the Excide 34XCD. While searching the archives, I found some references to
> building a NiMH pack out of F or D cells. Has anyone here done it recently?
> Would you recommend it? I need to keep the battery pack below about 250 kg
> for the vehicle safety inspection here (can't exceed GVWR), and a range of
> 60km would be nice - a 10 to 15 kW*h pack would probably be fine. I worked
> on an EV maybe 12 years ago, but it has been a while and things change in
> that amount of time. Thanks!
>
> Dale Ulan
> Calgary, Alberta, Canada
>
>
--
Edward Ang
President
AIR Lab Corp
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Having 3 EVs using them as part of your unobtainium test program is not
what I would call "using" them. It is called "product field testing".
Jack
Edward Ang wrote:
On 12/14/06, Jack Murray <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
As far as I know nobody has uses NiMH batteries.
Huh?! See www.airlabcorp.com
There are at least 3 EV's with D cell Nimh on the road today.
The D and F cell NiMH batteries commonly available are not suitable for
an EV because they have very limited discharge rates. Some of the newer
SubC batteries for R/C racing can discharge at high rates. They are
somewhat expensive and because of their capacity would require a lot of
them.
Intellect recently came out with a new D-cell 9Ah battery that performs
the same as their SubC R/C batteries with a 10C discharge rate (even 30C
with voltage sag), and I believe would be good for EV use.
Our supplier has tested these "super" Nimh cells at 30C. You really
do not want to do that. Cycle life is terrible and the cells
eventually swells and leaks. RC people do not care about cycle life.
They can just keep buying batteries every few months. We cannot
afford to do that.
Many, if not most, seem to disagree with me, or at least believe they
are too expensive. Many seem to be waiting for Lithium and believe that
Lithium batteries prices will be cut in half next month, and half again
the month after that, but even after that will still be more expensive
than these NiMH batteries.
So things HAVE changed in 12 years, the difference is people still use
lead-acid batteries, but now they complain about using them because
better options are available they can't or won't afford.
Hope that helps.
Jack
Dale Ulan wrote:
> I'm designing the battery system for a small-car (Honda Civic or
something
> like it) EV that I'm planning on building. This will be using a
brushless DC
> motor, 144V, 25kW (peak) - I have two motors, so if it's too
lethargic I can
> put on the second motor and controller. Anyways, I was originally
planning
> on using either Optima Yellow-Tops (D34's or two strings of D51's)
or maybe
> the Excide 34XCD. While searching the archives, I found some
references to
> building a NiMH pack out of F or D cells. Has anyone here done it
recently?
> Would you recommend it? I need to keep the battery pack below about
250 kg
> for the vehicle safety inspection here (can't exceed GVWR), and a
range of
> 60km would be nice - a 10 to 15 kW*h pack would probably be fine. I
worked
> on an EV maybe 12 years ago, but it has been a while and things
change in
> that amount of time. Thanks!
>
> Dale Ulan
> Calgary, Alberta, Canada
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
For 3.8 miles round trip, I use a bicycle.
My commute is 23 miles round trip, 20 if I avoid freeway,
which is required for a bicycle trip.
Preferably once a week I sling my laptop bag over my
shoulder and mount my bike for a healthy 50 min workout
in the morning and another one at night.
I try to use the electric assist only at places where traffic
is heavy to avoid frustrated motorists when I need to be
in their way (ride in the middle of the lane) and on
ramps like the overpass over the 101 freeway, so
I get a decent amount of workout in the rest of the time.
For the trip at night, good lights are required.
Another advantage of the electric assist bicycle,
is that it has a 24V 12Ah pack, so there is plenty
of energy to tap into via the charger port, which
provides a direct connect to the battery via a fuse.
(The charger smarts are in the power brick)
Hope this gives you ideas,
Cor van de Water
Systems Architect
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
Proxim Wireless Networks eFAX: +1-610-423-5743
Take your network further http://www.proxim.com
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Steve Powers
Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2006 7:13 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: If I only need a 5 mile range ... really
In my Festiva, ADC 9" motor, 400 A Curtis controller, I only need a max 5
mile range (its about 3.8 miles round trip). I want to lighten the car up
and save some money at the same time when I replace the pack.
If I put 10 of these in, do you think I could reliably get the 5 miles.
http://www.surpluscenter.com/item.asp?UID=2006121421031663&item=11-3096&catn
ame=
That's only 120 V x 54 AH ... not much at all ... maybe a usable 5kWh.
Speeds are as follows:
~.5 miles - 25 MPH
~1 mile - 40 MPH
~.5 miles - 30 MPH
each way
4 - 5 stop signs / lights
all flat roads
Other ideas ...
Steve
---------------------------------
Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail beta.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Lawrence,
Why does it need to be 240 Ohms?
If you are measuring voltage, then a 500 Ohm resistor
will result in two times the voltage, so you will need
to reduce the current to half to get the same reading.
If you measure current, then a 500 Ohm resistance will
reduce the current to half from the 240 Ohm case, so
you need to increase the voltage to get a higher reading
OR change the shunt through which you are measuring,
when it also is doubled the meter will see the same
voltage drop at half the current so the 500 Ohm
wound resistor will work fine.
Typically wire-wound resistors use an alloy that cannot
easily be soldered, so I would not try to go that route.
You will probably only mess your resistor up and if the
soldering succeeds at all, you will probably have several
bad solder joints.
If it is easy to re-winf the resistor then that may be
a good alternative.
But the easiest way is to check the total circuit, see
how it gets its reading and modify it for 500 Ohms.
If you need help then make a sketch of the circuit and
post a link to it, so we can advise how to change it.
Success,
Cor van de Water
Systems Architect
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
Proxim Wireless Networks eFAX: +1-610-423-5743
Take your network further http://www.proxim.com
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Lawrence Rhodes
Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2006 8:49 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: OT. Changing the value of a wound resistor.
There is a float that must pass up and down the windings. I can't block it
with anything. It's now 500 ohms. I was wondering if I just soldered the
windings together on every other winding if that will reduce the resistance?
It seems that it would be a very accurate way of reducing the ohms to 240.
That's the only way to do it without redoing the whole thing. It's a float
assembly for a Peugeot diesel tank sender which I'm using for vegetable oil.
The only other thing I can think of is to wind my own or buy a float and
adjust it to work with the Peugeot tank. Lawrence Rhodes....
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom Carpenter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2006 6:51 PM
Subject: Re: OT. Changing the value of a wound resistor.
> If you have two of these just parallel them.
>
>
> Tom
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[email protected]>
> Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2006 8:51 PM
> Subject: OT. Changing the value of a wound resistor.
>
>
> >I have an 8 inch wound risistor that is 500 ohms. I need a 250 ohm
> >resistor
> > of the same length. Can I insert solder between the windings to reduce
> > the
> > resistance of the resistor untill I have the resistance I want? The
> > resistance must still change gradually up and down the length of the
> > resistor. Lawrence Rhodes.........
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > No virus found in this incoming message.
> > Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> > Version: 7.1.409 / Virus Database: 268.15.19/587 - Release Date:
> > 12/14/2006
> >
> >
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Steve,
It looks like all the current goes through the M6 threaded end; I
can't imagine them holding up under much current. Also, there have been
posts on that battery before (search "sbs60/2" or "sbs-60").
If you have to ship them, I think golf cart batteries would be
cheaper. Plus, the cycle life of those batteries is unknown and could be
200 or 20 or 2.
Cory Cross
Steve Powers wrote:
>In my Festiva, ADC 9" motor, 400 A Curtis controller, I only need a max 5 mile
>range (its about 3.8 miles round trip). I want to lighten the car up and save
>some money at the same time when I replace the pack.
>
> If I put 10 of these in, do you think I could reliably get the 5 miles.
>
> http://www.surpluscenter.com/item.asp?UID=2006121421031663&item=11-3096&catname=
>
> That's only 120 V x 54 AH ... not much at all ... maybe a usable 5kWh.
>
> Speeds are as follows:
> ~.5 miles - 25 MPH
> ~1 mile - 40 MPH
> ~.5 miles - 30 MPH
> each way
>
> 4 - 5 stop signs / lights
> all flat roads
>
> Other ideas ...
>
> Steve
>
>
>---------------------------------
>Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail beta.
>
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Just for the record we used M6 bolt Hawkers on "The Maniac Mazda" when we
blew off Dodge Vipers using two 1400 amp Zillas and two strings of 26 amp/hr
Hawkers at 216 volts. The M6 is the bolt size, not the post size. Don't
worry, be happy :-)
Roderick Wilde
"Suck Amps EV Racing"
www.suckamps.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Cory Cross" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2006 11:19 PM
Subject: Re: If I only need a 5 mile range ... really
Hi Steve,
It looks like all the current goes through the M6 threaded end; I
can't imagine them holding up under much current. Also, there have been
posts on that battery before (search "sbs60/2" or "sbs-60").
If you have to ship them, I think golf cart batteries would be
cheaper. Plus, the cycle life of those batteries is unknown and could be
200 or 20 or 2.
Cory Cross
Steve Powers wrote:
In my Festiva, ADC 9" motor, 400 A Curtis controller, I only need a max 5
mile range (its about 3.8 miles round trip). I want to lighten the car up
and save some money at the same time when I replace the pack.
If I put 10 of these in, do you think I could reliably get the 5 miles.
http://www.surpluscenter.com/item.asp?UID=2006121421031663&item=11-3096&catname=
That's only 120 V x 54 AH ... not much at all ... maybe a usable 5kWh.
Speeds are as follows:
~.5 miles - 25 MPH
~1 mile - 40 MPH
~.5 miles - 30 MPH
each way
4 - 5 stop signs / lights
all flat roads
Other ideas ...
Steve
---------------------------------
Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail beta.
--
No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.1.409 / Virus Database: 268.15.18/586 - Release Date:
12/13/2006
--
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.1.409 / Virus Database: 268.15.18/586 - Release Date: 12/13/2006
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Dale, welcome to the list. I'm in Edmonon and it should be our goal to someday
travel the 200 miles between Edmonton and Calgary on a single charge with a bit
to spare.
I would recommend staying away from the small Nimh, not to say that it will
not work, it is just not worth the hassle. One of my ev projects uses 168 subC
Nimh
http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/737.
The bike works great and is a whole lot of fun but I am not diligently taking
care of the pack the way a daily use vehicle would require. I have also tested
a bunch of D size NiMh from Powerizer and from Tenergy. The cells were very
inconsistent, likely because they were not matched. There may be other D or F
manufacturers that are matching their cells like the RC subC cells. It would
take a lot of work to make a large pack and a lot more work to maintain it.
My suggestion is to using the largest capacity cells you can fit into your
vehicle but your weight limit will limit your range with pb At present I
have two EVs in the works, one of which will use a bank of 95AH Panasonic NiMh
that were salvaged from a Ranger EV. The other will use AGM pb and be high
performance with a Zilla 2K, twin motors, etc.
If you want to play with smaller cells, go with the M1 from A123. At
present, I have several Dewalt A123 packs that I am testing. Remarkable cells.
On my test bench, I can discharge a single 2.3ah string at 40 amps and
recharge at 20 amps. Full discharge and recharge in just over 10 minutes. I
am sure that A123 does not recommend this as continual practice, but I ran
several tests. Remarkable cells. I plan to replace the Odyssey pb pack I have
in my EZE sports bike with 240 of the A123 cells. The bike should drop 70 lbs
of weight and have better range and better performance. Bill Dube, aka
"superfast Killacycle, record holder EV", has suggested up to 100 amp per
string. Awsome.
http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/716
Just my 2 nanowatts worth on batteries. I have done a bit testing on several
AGMs, big and small Nimh and now with A123.
I am curious as to your brushless DC motor and controller. What type are
they?
Ray Wong P Eng
Ezesport
Dale Ulan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
I'm designing the battery system for a small-car (Honda Civic or something
like it) EV that I'm planning on building. This will be using a brushless DC
motor, 144V, 25kW (peak) - I have two motors, so if it's too lethargic I can
put on the second motor and controller. Anyways, I was originally planning
on using either Optima Yellow-Tops (D34's or two strings of D51's) or maybe
the Excide 34XCD. While searching the archives, I found some references to
building a NiMH pack out of F or D cells. Has anyone here done it recently?
Would you recommend it? I need to keep the battery pack below about 250 kg
for the vehicle safety inspection here (can't exceed GVWR), and a range of
60km would be nice - a 10 to 15 kW*h pack would probably be fine. I worked
on an EV maybe 12 years ago, but it has been a while and things change in
that amount of time. Thanks!
Dale Ulan
Calgary, Alberta, Canada
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
this is interesting
You I think there should be a huge tax credit in places like la for
converting your second car to electric. I am thinking of one car having
less than 40 roundtrip ability which could easily be done with cheap
batteries, one easy motor and no regen capacity.
Frankly most la driving is much less than 40 miles roundtrip.
This is the missing niche.
Keep your one gas guzzler for highway trips but low tech convert your
daily use vehicle for your personal electric commute for about $2000 and
save $100 to 300 a month in gas.
-----Original Message-----
News
December 13, 2006 Spare Power Sufficient to Fuel Switch from Gas to
Electric Cars Existing U.S. power plants could provide enough juice to
switch 84 percent of the 220 million American vehicles on the road from
gasoline to electricity.
Now a new analysis from the U.S. Department of Energy's Pacific
Northwest National Laboratory (PNNL) offers more good news: existing
electric power plants could fuel 84 percent of "light duty" vehicles if
all 220 million cars and trucks converted to electric power overnight.
"We're delighted to see solid third-party confirmation of what the
people who know best--the utilities--have been saying for sometime,"
says Felix Kramer, plug-in hybrid owner/evangelist and founder of
Calcars.org.
The analysis noted that the capacity of the U.S. power infrastructure is
underutilized. Every evening--and during days of low demand--there is a
large amount of spare capacity that could easily be tapped. By charging
cars and trucks with electricity at night, American drivers could reduce
the nation's dependence on foreign oil while potentially cutting power
prices as well.
--
Steven S. Lough, Pres.
Seattle EV Association
6021 32nd Ave. N.E.
Seattle, WA 98115-7230
Day: 206 850-8535
Eve: 206 524-1351
e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
web: http://www.seattleeva.org
www.GlobalBoiling.com for daily images about hurricanes, globalwarming
and the melting poles.
www.ElectricQuakes.com daily solar and earthquake images.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
These scam artists have long depended on people who act on "the slight
chance it is for real". You're not seriously going to buy the welder,
are you? Or are you just saying you would to go fishing them?
Danny
David J. Hrivnak wrote:
I too believe this is bogus. But on the SLIGHT chance it was for real I
singed up for more information and even to buy a welder. As I suspected my
e-mails and calls have remained unanswered.
David J. Hrivnak
www.hrivnak.com
Personal Account WWJD?
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Tim
I'm converting a Porsche 944, and the chassis and body of this car are
galvanized. There's
virutally no rust anywhere on this 20 year old car. What's it made of? Metal is
as close as I can
get, sorry.
Dave Cover
--- Tim Gamber <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hi everyone i am doing a project on galvanization and would like to know a
> few products that are galvanized and what kind of metals are used for
> galvanizing. Any info on this subject would be great.
>
> _________________________________________________________________
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>
>
--- End Message ---
