EV Digest 6461
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: Battery amps in Uve's EV Calculator
by Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) 6V AGM's
by Frank John <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Breaker mounting
by Eduardo Kaftanski <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: Breaker mounting
by "Peter VanDerWal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: [EV] Re: Breaker mounting
by Eduardo Kaftanski <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) RE: Breaker mounting
by Don Cameron <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) RE: Green Meanie motors on Ebay
by "Shawn Waggoner, FLEAA" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) RE: [EV] Re: Breaker mounting
by Don Cameron <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) RE: Green Meanie motors on Ebay
by Jim Husted <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: Regenerative suspension
by "Chris" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Re: [EV] RE: Breaker mounting
by Eduardo Kaftanski <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Re: Controlling an alternator (without wrecking it)?
by "Darin - at - metrompg.com" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Fully sprung 'direct drive' (was: Regenerative suspension)
by "Adrian DeLeon" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re: Industrial Directories
by Eric Poulsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Any one need juice
by "Patrick Andrews" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) WAS: Regenerative suspension, NOW Bose Supension
by "Chris" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) WHO got the Rav4 EV
by Steven Lough <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Re: Controlling an alternator (without wrecking it)?
by "Roland Wiench" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Re: Regenerative suspension
by Bill Dube <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) RE: Any one need juice
by Don Cameron <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) RE: T-105 Sitcker Shock
by Mark Brueggemann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) Re: EV bashing, RE: T-105 Sitcker Shock
by Mark Brueggemann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) RE: EV bashing, RE: T-105 Sitcker Shock
by Mark Brueggemann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) Re: Regenerative suspension
by Mark Brueggemann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25) RE: T-105 Sitcker Shock
by Don Cameron <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
26) Anyone need juice 2
by "Patrick Andrews" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
27) RE: T-105 Sitcker Shock
by "damon henry" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
28) RE: EV bashing, RE: T-105 Sitcker Shock
by Cor van de Water <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
29) RE: Controlling an alternator (without wrecking it)?
by Cor van de Water <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
I dissassembled a warp 9's commutator and it was the cheapest,weakest
type. copper bars have little feet in the mica filled plastic. There are
no risers, just the windings welded to the bar. These "stacked" windings
and the fact that the welding probably compromises the plastic
underneath if done wrong leads to a failure-mode where the windings lift
out the bars. In my case the plastic just gave way, not 1 of the 59 bars
broke the copper nubs off in the plastic. In a pure case on irony, the
ADC comms were better. It annoys me that manufactures try to save a few
bucks relative to the overall sale price. At one time, I checked into a
commutator manufacturer and if 5 of us got together we could get the
steel mica and copper v-ring style commutators for about $110 each.
Jim Husted had pictures of my disassembled commutator up on his web site
at www.*hi**torque**electric*.com in the oops category, but I can't get
to the site this morning to check.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I'm wondering about the use of 6V AGM's in a pickup conversion project (instead
of flooded PbA's). Does anyone have any thoughts, experience, etc.? Anyone
built a regulator? I know that they're typically rated a bit less (C/20) but
real life may be different?
thanks
Frank
____________________________________________________________________________________
No need to miss a message. Get email on-the-go
with Yahoo! Mail for Mobile. Get started.
http://mobile.yahoo.com/mail
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi,
I bought a breaker from the surplus site. An Airpax 250A 160V.
Problem is I cant find the right screw to fix it to the front mounting
holes... Tried 5mm and 9/16 and both are the right diameter but the
wrong pitch...
Web site says '# 6-32' but I cant find that around here... Any
other name for it so I can find it?
Thanks.
--
Eduardo K. |
http://www.carfun.cl | I'm white and nerdy
http://e.nn.cl | Weird Al
http://ev.nn.cl |
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
6-32 is a pretty standard thread size here in the US, just about every
hardware store has them in stock.
If you have trouble getting it where you live, you can try one of the
online places.
For example both
http://www.smallparts.com/ and http://www.mcmaster.com/
carry them.
> Hi,
>
> I bought a breaker from the surplus site. An Airpax 250A 160V.
>
> Problem is I cant find the right screw to fix it to the front mounting
> holes... Tried 5mm and 9/16 and both are the right diameter but the
> wrong pitch...
>
> Web site says '# 6-32' but I cant find that around here... Any
> other name for it so I can find it?
>
> Thanks.
>
>
> --
> Eduardo K. |
> http://www.carfun.cl | I'm white and nerdy
> http://e.nn.cl | Weird Al
> http://ev.nn.cl |
>
>
--
If you send email to me, or the EVDL, that has > 4 lines of legalistic
junk at the end; then you are specifically authorizing me to do whatever I
wish with the message. By posting the message you agree that your long
legalistic signature is void.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Fri, Feb 23, 2007 at 09:41:59AM -0700, Peter VanDerWal wrote:
> 6-32 is a pretty standard thread size here in the US, just about every
> hardware store has them in stock.
>
is it metric? or a us only thread? (I am not in the US :)
thanks.
--
Eduardo K. |
http://www.carfun.cl | I'm white and nerdy
http://e.nn.cl | Weird Al
http://ev.nn.cl |
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Eduardo,
The name is #6-32. Quite popular in the US and Canada. Contact a local
industrial supply company or industrial fastener, they might be have it or
be able to order it.
What I find confusing is that a 6-32 is 2.7mm which is quite a bit smaller
than 5mm and 9/16 is 14mm?!??
Don Cameron, Victoria, BC, Canada
---------------------------------------------------
See the New Beetle EV project www.cameronsoftware.com/ev
Check the EVDL Archives: http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/ev-list-archive
Check out the EV FAQ: www.evparts.com/faq
Check out the EV Photo Album: www.evalbum.com
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Eduardo Kaftanski
Sent: February 23, 2007 7:20 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Breaker mounting
Hi,
I bought a breaker from the surplus site. An Airpax 250A 160V.
Problem is I cant find the right screw to fix it to the front
mounting holes... Tried 5mm and 9/16 and both are the right diameter but the
wrong pitch...
Web site says '# 6-32' but I cant find that around here... Any other
name for it so I can find it?
Thanks.
--
Eduardo K. |
http://www.carfun.cl | I'm white and nerdy
http://e.nn.cl | Weird Al
http://ev.nn.cl |
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
<snip>
You know you just can't trust those Floridians, hehe.
At least this way if they're gonna be raced they have
a better chance of actually getting a record, ohh 8^P
Anyway what's the scoop?
Cya
Jim
</snip>
Ouch man! Is that what happens to you people up there when you don't see the
sun for months and freeze all winter??? You get a little cranky. Relax! Have
a beer - you know it'll be a cold one! ;-)
The guy who bought the motors is going to be putting both of them on a nice
hi performance street bike. Speaking with him, it sounds like he is gonna
try to go take on some local gasers with CBR600's. I'm sure he'll be posting
soon about it. With those motors and the rest of setup, he should need
flight clearance before he takes it out! I'll let him announce the
details...
See ya,
Shawn
(In FL - oh look, there's the sun again...)
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
It is a US thread. #6 is about 9/64 of an inch, 32 means 32 threads per
inch.
Don Cameron, Victoria, BC, Canada
---------------------------------------------------
See the New Beetle EV project www.cameronsoftware.com/ev
Check the EVDL Archives: http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/ev-list-archive
Check out the EV FAQ: www.evparts.com/faq
Check out the EV Photo Album: www.evalbum.com
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Eduardo Kaftanski
Sent: February 23, 2007 8:06 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [EV] Re: Breaker mounting
On Fri, Feb 23, 2007 at 09:41:59AM -0700, Peter VanDerWal wrote:
> 6-32 is a pretty standard thread size here in the US, just about every
> hardware store has them in stock.
>
is it metric? or a us only thread? (I am not in the US :)
thanks.
--
Eduardo K. |
http://www.carfun.cl | I'm white and nerdy
http://e.nn.cl | Weird Al
http://ev.nn.cl |
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
--- "Shawn Waggoner, FLEAA" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
><snip> Ouch man! Is that what happens to you people
>up there when you don't see the sun for months and
>freeze all winter??? You get a little cranky. Relax!
>Have a beer - you know it'll be a cold one! ;-)
Man did you hit that nail on the head! LMAO!!
I just asked James Massey if he was done being greedy
with the sun a couple weeks back! Being I was born
and raised in S. Cali the only thing I don't like
about Oregon is the 10 months of winter it gets lol!
Spring will be here by late June so I don't have long
to wait now, LMAO!
> The guy who bought the motors is going to be putting
> both of them on a nice
> hi performance street bike. Speaking with him, it
> sounds like he is gonna
> try to go take on some local gasers with CBR600's.
> I'm sure he'll be posting
> soon about it. With those motors and the rest of
> setup, he should need
> flight clearance before he takes it out! I'll let
> him announce the
> details...
Actually he wrote me last night and he just can't wait
to get them so I know this is a win, win, win for all
involved.
For those who don't know, I consider both Matt and
Shawn to be close dear friends and we've done a number
of projects together bartering, and trading both time
and toys. To offer my true feelings toward them (and
Florida) I believe the west coast boys better start
notching up the belt or they will begin to steal the
show. My hats off to the effort that's being done
over there! Hope no one thought I was serious with my
public Shawn bashing 8^P I'll try to keep it to a
minumum but it's kind of like a lure to a trout and I
find I just have to hit it, LMAO!!
> See ya,
>
> Shawn
> (In FL - oh look, there's the sun again...)
Ya well when the big bad wolf comes and blows your
house down I'll be really happy to be freezing my butt
off here in Oregon, ya know I hate wind just a tad
more then cold, hehehe!
Anyway had fun, can't wait to get a report on how the
motors perform at there better home!
Cya all
Jim Husted
Hi-Torque Electric
____________________________________________________________________________________
Food fight? Enjoy some healthy debate
in the Yahoo! Answers Food & Drink Q&A.
http://answers.yahoo.com/dir/?link=list&sid=396545367
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Bose have made regen linear suspension already.
http://www.bose.com/controller?
event=VIEW_STATIC_PAGE_EVENT&url=/popup/tech_details/pop_vid_susp_spee
dbump.jsp&ck=0
Or here http://tinyurl.com/2ae2nl
At the bottom right of that page you can see video showing the
comparisons between a conventional setup and their setup.
It perhaps isn't what was being talked about inasmuch as it requires
a power input to make it work but it's cool.
The Shake-a-light idea has occured to me aswell. I bought my wife one
of those torches for Christmas (not the only thing I bought her ;-) )
and I like the novelty of it, but it does have some merit.
I wouldn't know where to start by calculating output ofr a scaled up
version, or if it would be better to pack many smaller ones together,
yet.
Chris
--- In [EMAIL PROTECTED], "Kaido Kert" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> A short google later:
> http://www.voanews.com/english/archive/2006-01/2006-01-20-voa29.cfm?
CFID=99046733&CFTOKEN=76443482
> "University of Texas in the city of Austin has developed a new
> electric suspension system that makes off-road rides almost as
smooth
> as those over a paved highway. Amy Katz narrates."
> "It has a spring also that supports the vehicle weight, but instead
of
> the shock absorbers it has this actuator and that actuator will put
> out any force that we command it to put out."
>
> The key components are an electric motor driving a rack and pinion
at
> each wheel, accelerometers and a computerized control system."
>
> Their system probably doesnt regen, as the goal is simply a softer
> ride. but turning that setup into regen shouldnt be a rocket
science.
>
> -kert
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Fri, Feb 23, 2007 at 08:35:36AM -0800, Don Cameron wrote:
> Eduardo,
>
> The name is #6-32. Quite popular in the US and Canada. Contact a local
> industrial supply company or industrial fastener, they might be have it or
> be able to order it.
>
> What I find confusing is that a 6-32 is 2.7mm which is quite a bit smaller
> than 5mm and 9/16 is 14mm?!??
Sorry... it was 5/16...
5/16 goes in a couple of threads. I can make it work if I cannot find
the correct one :(
--
Eduardo K. |
http://www.carfun.cl | I'm white and nerdy
http://e.nn.cl | Weird Al
http://ev.nn.cl |
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Lee Hart wrote:
Pretty close. You don't cut the field wire itself; you find the wire that is
sensing the battery voltage, and change its circuit.
Are alternators normally connected to a car's keyswitch circuit? Or
are they always "on", meaning, if you de-belted and spun the alternator
in an ICE car which isn't running - key OFF - would it try to generate
output?
What I'm wondering is whether using the alternator's keyswitch circuit
(if it exists) is another option for controlling regen. EG. connect
that circuit via the brake switch to turn the alternator ON / OFF.
It would save having to come up with a 14v supply to feed the voltage
regulator to keep the alternator "inactive" when not needed.
Darin
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
The regen suspension thing gave me an interesting idea...
Think back to the recent discussions about hub motors being impractical -
unobtainable, expensive, gearing issues, and weight. Now think about a
single speed reduction similar to that of an e-scooter. Large gear on the
wheel, small one on the motor, chain/belt connecting the two. Why not
apply that to a car?
Or a more extreme case: A large gear on the drive wheel connected directly
to a small gear on the motor shaft. The suspension would be set up to
follow a short arc, keeping the gears meshed as the wheel bounces over
uneven surfaces.
How about a beefy shaft drive like the ATVs and a few motorcycles? Ha!
The result would be similar to having lightweight hub motors, but without
the extra weight in the wheel. Single speed reduction, small unspring
weight, no tranny, differential, CV axles, etc. The big difference being
you can't just pop the wheel off to change/maintain the motor. Road debris
would be a problem. It might also be difficult to locate the motors
without serious modifications to an existing ICE glider.
(Anyone remember the ATV commercials when shaft drive first hit the
market? Picture a car on a mechanic's lift with a large gear between the
axles and a huge chain connecting it to the engine...)
And I cringe thinking about a tire shop popping a hub motor off of my EV
to put new rubber on!
-Adrian
.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I know when I search Google, I often _exclude_ globalspec.com and
thomasnet.com. They do categorize and and list industrial suppliers.
Most of the hits I receive (that are on globalspec or thomasnet) come up
because the companies listed have poor or non-extant websites that
wouldn't show up in a search anyway. Of course, there's always Alibaba
if you need to find suppliers of large volumes of stuff that is mostly crap.
However, I'm the type of person that would generally rather not deal
with a company either doesn't have a website, or isn't really interested
in generating sales from it. I'm talking about the ones who have a
"brochure" site, or if they list products, then the price is always
"Call" or "inquire." I want to compare prices right now, and not be
given a sales pitch.
Don Cameron wrote:
Hi all, I am looking for a variety of specialty hardware and electronics
and wonder if anyone can suggest industrial directories on the web that they
find useful. I know of two:
1) MacReasBlueBook.com
2) KellySearch.com
Any other suggestions?
thanks
Don Cameron, Victoria, BC, Canada
---------------------------------------------------
See the New Beetle EV project www.cameronsoftware.com/ev
Check the EVDL Archives: http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/ev-list-archive
Check out the EV FAQ: www.evparts.com/faq
Check out the EV Photo Album: www.evalbum.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi my name is Patrick Andrews im a new subscriber to this ev list. In the
past 5 years I have worked for two large companies in rechargable battery
industry. Multiplier Industries and Emerging power. I anyone is looking for
more power less weight faster charge and safe li-ion battery system let me
know. [EMAIL PROTECTED]
_________________________________________________________________
Want a degree but can't afford to quit? Top school degrees online - in as
fast as 1 year
http://forms.nextag.com/goto.jsp?url=/serv/main/buyer/education.jsp?doSearch=n&tm=y&search=education_text_links_88_h288c&s=4079&p=5116
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Messed up my links there I think and only posted the video one.
Here's the link to their regen suspension pages
http://tinyurl.com/39n35t
Chris
--- In [EMAIL PROTECTED], "Chris" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Bose have made regen linear suspension already.
> http://www.bose.com/controller?
>
event=VIEW_STATIC_PAGE_EVENT&url=/popup/tech_details/pop_vid_susp_spee
> dbump.jsp&ck=0
>
> Or here http://tinyurl.com/2ae2nl
>
> At the bottom right of that page you can see video showing the
> comparisons between a conventional setup and their setup.
>
> It perhaps isn't what was being talked about inasmuch as it
requires
> a power input to make it work but it's cool.
>
> The Shake-a-light idea has occured to me aswell. I bought my wife
one
> of those torches for Christmas (not the only thing I bought her ;-
) )
> and I like the novelty of it, but it does have some merit.
>
> I wouldn't know where to start by calculating output ofr a scaled
up
> version, or if it would be better to pack many smaller ones
together,
> yet.
>
> Chris
>
>
> --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED], "Kaido Kert" <ev@> wrote:
> >
> > A short google later:
> > http://www.voanews.com/english/archive/2006-01/2006-01-20-
voa29.cfm?
> CFID=99046733&CFTOKEN=76443482
> > "University of Texas in the city of Austin has developed a new
> > electric suspension system that makes off-road rides almost as
> smooth
> > as those over a paved highway. Amy Katz narrates."
> > "It has a spring also that supports the vehicle weight, but
instead
> of
> > the shock absorbers it has this actuator and that actuator will
put
> > out any force that we command it to put out."
> >
> > The key components are an electric motor driving a rack and
pinion
> at
> > each wheel, accelerometers and a computerized control system."
> >
> > Their system probably doesnt regen, as the goal is simply a softer
> > ride. but turning that setup into regen shouldnt be a rocket
> science.
> >
> > -kert
> >
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
This may have been solved already, but a fellow in Woodinville, WA
(NE of Seattle) by the name of Dan Davids seems to be a new owner of a
RAV4 EV ! I learned this from a
e-mail forward from Ron Freund, who suggested that we bring Dan into the
SEVA Fold, being he is in our neighborhood.
Here are a few excerpts from his POST to Ron.
--------------------------------------------------------
>My name is Dan Davids and I live in Woodinville, a suburb of Seattle,
>WA. Permit me to introduce myself to the RAV4 EV group.
>I am now very excited to announce to the group that a RAV4 EV is on
>its way to Puget Sound. I purchased the one sold a few weeks ago on
>eBay by pluginamerica. I flew down to LA and met Paul Scott, Chelsea
>and Bob Sexton, and Chris Paine at a showing of WKtEC in Santa
>Monica. Alexandra Paul came by to pin an "Ask Me About My Electric
>Car" button on my jacket.
>My first task is to install the charger at my office, a corporate
>airplane hangar at Paine Field in Everett.
>I will be installing a Manzanita charger in the car, and will assemble
>a pack of plug adapters and extension cords to carry along.
--------------------------------------------------------
Rich ! Do you know about this ??
--------------------------------------------------------
So.. There we have it. Thanks to Ron, and the Rav4 EV Group..
I have Sent "Welcome to SEVA" to Dan Davids this a.m.
PS: Strange, but The Green Car Company of Kirkland WA. also seems to
have just acquired a Rav4 EV !! Mater of fact, a few weeks ago, they
drove it all the way to Olympia Wa. ( our Capitol ) for an EV
Show-n-tell. !! Could this some how be the SAME ONE... Or do
we have TWO RAV4 EV's in our back yard now ? ? ? ?
--
Steven S. Lough, Pres.
Seattle EV Association
6021 32nd Ave. N.E.
Seattle, WA 98115-7230
Day: 206 850-8535
Eve: 206 524-1351
e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
web: http://www.seattleeva.org
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
If you have a two wire control alternator that has two wires in the small
plastic plug, One wire ( the small one comes from the ignition circuit that
provides 12 volt this R wire or to the regulator. There is a larger red
wire in this plastic plug that is connected directly to battery B+. All
you have to do is to switch off the R wire to stop the alternator generated
output.
Use a micro switch on the accelerator control or the main contactor if it
turns off every time you let up on the accelerator.
I use a deep cycle battery for my 12 volt accessory battery, so I can
discharge it more deeply than a standard battery.
Use a three position selector switch, so you can either have the accelerator
control the R wire or leave it on all the time, or turn it off.
Roland
----- Original Message -----
From: "Darin - at - metrompg.com" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2007 11:25 AM
Subject: Re: Controlling an alternator (without wrecking it)?
> Lee Hart wrote:
>
> > Pretty close. You don't cut the field wire itself; you find the wire
> > that is sensing the battery voltage, and change its circuit.
>
> Are alternators normally connected to a car's keyswitch circuit? Or
> are they always "on", meaning, if you de-belted and spun the alternator
> in an ICE car which isn't running - key OFF - would it try to generate
> output?
>
> What I'm wondering is whether using the alternator's keyswitch circuit
> (if it exists) is another option for controlling regen. EG. connect
> that circuit via the brake switch to turn the alternator ON / OFF.
>
> It would save having to come up with a 14v supply to feed the voltage
> regulator to keep the alternator "inactive" when not needed.
>
> Darin
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I looked into regenerative suspension for a solar car project, (but
never implemented anything.) The most promising system was a
piezo-electric approach. About ten years ago, K2 skis developed a
piezo damping system that looked like just the perfect solution for a
regenerative active suspension system:
http://classic.mountainzone.com/ski/99/k2/
Lightweight, simple, and reliable.
Google "piezo skis" and you will get plenty of information. The skis
worked too well. Folks said they couldn't feel the bumps. The skis
felt "dead". Folks don't want floating on a cloud type comfort, they
want to feel _all_ the sensations of skiing.
Bill Dube'
At 11:52 AM 2/23/2007, you wrote:
Bose have made regen linear suspension already.
http://www.bose.com/controller?
event=VIEW_STATIC_PAGE_EVENT&url=/popup/tech_details/pop_vid_susp_spee
dbump.jsp&ck=0
Or here http://tinyurl.com/2ae2nl
At the bottom right of that page you can see video showing the
comparisons between a conventional setup and their setup.
It perhaps isn't what was being talked about inasmuch as it requires
a power input to make it work but it's cool.
The Shake-a-light idea has occured to me aswell. I bought my wife one
of those torches for Christmas (not the only thing I bought her ;-) )
and I like the novelty of it, but it does have some merit.
I wouldn't know where to start by calculating output ofr a scaled up
version, or if it would be better to pack many smaller ones together,
yet.
Chris
--- In [EMAIL PROTECTED], "Kaido Kert" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> A short google later:
> http://www.voanews.com/english/archive/2006-01/2006-01-20-voa29.cfm?
CFID=99046733&CFTOKEN=76443482
> "University of Texas in the city of Austin has developed a new
> electric suspension system that makes off-road rides almost as
smooth
> as those over a paved highway. Amy Katz narrates."
> "It has a spring also that supports the vehicle weight, but instead
of
> the shock absorbers it has this actuator and that actuator will put
> out any force that we command it to put out."
>
> The key components are an electric motor driving a rack and pinion
at
> each wheel, accelerometers and a computerized control system."
>
> Their system probably doesnt regen, as the goal is simply a softer
> ride. but turning that setup into regen shouldnt be a rocket
science.
>
> -kert
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Patrick, this is a **very** common topic. Do you have a specific product
that you are selling that perhaps is usable for EVs? Care to tell the list,
so we all can review and discuss?
thanks
Don Cameron, Victoria, BC, Canada
---------------------------------------------------
See the New Beetle EV project www.cameronsoftware.com/ev
Check the EVDL Archives: http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/ev-list-archive
Check out the EV FAQ: www.evparts.com/faq
Check out the EV Photo Album: www.evalbum.com
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Patrick Andrews
Sent: February 23, 2007 11:11 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Any one need juice
Hi my name is Patrick Andrews im a new subscriber to this ev list. In the
past 5 years I have worked for two large companies in rechargable battery
industry. Multiplier Industries and Emerging power. I anyone is looking for
more power less weight faster charge and safe li-ion battery system let me
know. [EMAIL PROTECTED]
_________________________________________________________________
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--- Begin Message ---
I hope this isn't construed as EV bashing...
--- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> My EV's will go twice as far on the same dollar if I drive
> them 15 mph slower ,,, so the cost is very much up to me ...
I refuse to do that on prinicple. My buddy Tom Stockebrand
who I consider my EV mentor (and currently driving an S-10
EV in FL) was very concerned about the image of EV's. Many
EV'ers are proud of their conversions and proudly display
some sort of logo or "electric" sticker, or something on it
to show it's different. His opinion, and I share it, is that
the last thing you want is to have people be stuck behind
you, seeing you're in an EV and driving slowly, as though
all EV's were slow. Not that I drive like many ICE maniacs
out there, but I always stay with the flow of traffic, whether
on surface streets at 35 or highway at 75. Not passing, not
being passed.
> I have never replaced the brakes or done any
> suspension repair,,, becuse of the way I drive
Clearly brake life is dependent on driving habits, but the
suspension wear is based on weight, compression and cycles. Not
sure what the roads are like in FL, if they're glass smooth
that might explain it. My front springs have compressed 3/4
inch and the backs over twice that since I built it. I'm carrying
about half a ton over stock weight, I would expect the springs to
fatigue faster.
> if you are really tring to make it work ,,, then it will ...
Back to the principle thing, I show no favoritism. I use the
EV as I did when it was ICE. It should stand on it's own merit.
In terms of utility, the only thing I lost was the ability to
take long trips. I have never been disappointed with it's
performance or reliability.
> BEV's couldn't make it 30 years ago, and they won't today.
>
> The price of gas is what will change all that ,,,
No argument. I would expect the price of batteries to rise
approximately at the rate of inflation, but they too spiked
about the same way gas has. Now, if batteries could just
maintain for a while...
> with each pack are you getting more miles
No. The truck has held steady at about 350Wh/mi, and my
driving style and routes are pretty consistent.
> and how many miles are you getting on your pack
Between 16-18K.
> I'm getting about 18,000
Well, we're not that far apart then, even though I don't drive
15mph below the limit.
Mark Brueggemann
Albuquerque, NM
S-10 EV
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
--- jerryd <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> He, like the auto companies, are blaming EV's for their
> own mistakes.
> And by simply changing bodies, bed, lowering drag,
> lightening things up, ect, he could have a good cost
> effective EV at a reasonable price with great range, battery
> life.
I would like to know more. What can you change on an S-10
that isn't batteries, motor or frame that can make a
substantial enough difference to actually extend range, and
still be a pickup? I would estimate the body to weigh maybe
1000lbs. I still need a seat, glass, bumpers and lights, and
even composite body panels would have weight, so how much
could I possibly save, a few hundred pounds at the most?
Or am I missing something more obvious than that? This thing
has the Cd of a brick, but since it spends most of it's time
below 40mph, I don't think aerodynamics are going to improve
things to any great extent. What changes would you suggest,
and not detract from the function or safety of the vehicle?
Mark Brueggemann
Albuquerque, NM
S-10 EV
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
--- Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> EVs built from scratch have much better performance than ICE
> conversions that people have to cobble together themselves.
> But, scratch built EVs are mighty scarce!
The scratch builts are a great educational tool, but it kind
of scares me that people might consider these for transportation.
The primary reason I'm driving a "lead pig" is I stand a
chance of surviving an encounter with another vehicle. All
the low Cd, performance, efficiency, economy, etc is out the
window when you're squashed under a Suburban.
Mark Brueggemann
Albuquerque, NM
S-10 EV
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
--- Kaido Kert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> .. how much energy does a normal shock turn into heat ?
Every try and touch a shock on an off-road motorcycle or ATV
after a hard run? Quite a bit, I would say.
Mark Brueggemann
Albuquerque, NM
S-10 EV
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I am confused. Lots of people are offering solutions to your complaints,
but you seem like you are not interested.
What is it that you are after? Is it simply to say that EVs don't work for
you? If so, you have clearly made your point. Are you trying to convice
others to avoid EVs? If so, take it to another forum (David has pointed
out, the EVDL is not the list arguing the validity of EVs).
If you have a specific EV need that you want truly want solved, then post
your question.
Don Cameron, Victoria, BC, Canada
---------------------------------------------------
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-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Mark Brueggemann
Sent: February 23, 2007 11:51 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: T-105 Sitcker Shock
I hope this isn't construed as EV bashing...
--- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> My EV's will go twice as far on the same dollar if I drive them 15 mph
> slower ,,, so the cost is very much up to me ...
I refuse to do that on prinicple. My buddy Tom Stockebrand who I consider
my EV mentor (and currently driving an S-10 EV in FL) was very concerned
about the image of EV's. Many EV'ers are proud of their conversions and
proudly display some sort of logo or "electric" sticker, or something on it
to show it's different. His opinion, and I share it, is that the last thing
you want is to have people be stuck behind you, seeing you're in an EV and
driving slowly, as though all EV's were slow. Not that I drive like many
ICE maniacs out there, but I always stay with the flow of traffic, whether
on surface streets at 35 or highway at 75. Not passing, not being passed.
> I have never replaced the brakes or done any
> suspension repair,,, becuse of the way I drive
Clearly brake life is dependent on driving habits, but the
suspension wear is based on weight, compression and cycles. Not
sure what the roads are like in FL, if they're glass smooth
that might explain it. My front springs have compressed 3/4
inch and the backs over twice that since I built it. I'm carrying
about half a ton over stock weight, I would expect the springs to
fatigue faster.
> if you are really tring to make it work ,,, then it will ...
Back to the principle thing, I show no favoritism. I use the
EV as I did when it was ICE. It should stand on it's own merit.
In terms of utility, the only thing I lost was the ability to
take long trips. I have never been disappointed with it's
performance or reliability.
> BEV's couldn't make it 30 years ago, and they won't today.
>
> The price of gas is what will change all that ,,,
No argument. I would expect the price of batteries to rise
approximately at the rate of inflation, but they too spiked
about the same way gas has. Now, if batteries could just
maintain for a while...
> with each pack are you getting more miles
No. The truck has held steady at about 350Wh/mi, and my
driving style and routes are pretty consistent.
> and how many miles are you getting on your pack
Between 16-18K.
> I'm getting about 18,000
Well, we're not that far apart then, even though I don't drive
15mph below the limit.
Mark Brueggemann
Albuquerque, NM
S-10 EV
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I have the capability of building battery packs from 3.6v to 1500v there is
no limit. Depending on the customers specification and used battery price
will vary. If anyone is interested in a Li-Ion system let me know of the
general use desired voltage and A/h. These packs have electronically
controlled limits as far as Voltage high/low Temperature cutoff high/low
Amperage draw limit ect. I do freelance work for a company Emerging Power. I
don't represent a large company however i have a wealth of knowledge for
high volume production of intrinsically safe li-ion batteries. I would like
to add there is only one lithium battery system in production that has been
deemed intrinsically safe by FM Global and I was one of the engineers who
worked on it the other is a good friend of mine who was an electrical
engineer for Curtis Instruments.
_________________________________________________________________
Want a degree but can't afford to quit? Top school degrees online - in as
fast as 1 year
http://forms.nextag.com/goto.jsp?url=/serv/main/buyer/education.jsp?doSearch=n&tm=y&search=education_text_links_88_h288c&s=4079&p=5116
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Sorry Don, but there is nothing in the EVDL charter that states discussions
must be limited to specific EV needs we want help in solving. If we did
that we would miss out on all the Part 1,2,3 stories that people post when
something exciting happens.
It's clear to me what Mark is doing. He posted a question about battery
prices and wrote a long, well thought out post about his experiences with
his EV that he has driven 50K miles. Since then he has been responding to
other peoples responses (mostly criticisms) and been very civil in nature
yet firm in his positions.
If you are getting tired of the thread start hitting the delete key, I know
it has just about run it's course with me.
From: Don Cameron <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
If you have a specific EV need that you want truly want solved, then post
your question.
damon
_________________________________________________________________
With tax season right around the corner, make sure to follow these few
simple tips.
http://articles.moneycentral.msn.com/Taxes/PreparationTips/PreparationTips.aspx?icid=HMFebtagline
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Mark,
We all have our own background.
Jerry is good at building light-weight 3-wheelers as you
probably already knew.
Aero and light EVs with great range can be built that way.
If you need the utility of a pickup, that is not the best
way to go.
Regards,
Cor van de Water
Systems Architect
Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
Second Life: www.secondlife.com/?u=3b42cb3f4ae249319edb487991c30acb
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Mark Brueggemann
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2007 11:59 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: EV bashing, RE: T-105 Sitcker Shock
--- jerryd <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> He, like the auto companies, are blaming EV's for their own mistakes.
> And by simply changing bodies, bed, lowering drag, lightening things
> up, ect, he could have a good cost effective EV at a reasonable price
> with great range, battery life.
I would like to know more. What can you change on an S-10 that isn't
batteries, motor or frame that can make a substantial enough difference to
actually extend range, and still be a pickup? I would estimate the body to
weigh maybe 1000lbs. I still need a seat, glass, bumpers and lights, and
even composite body panels would have weight, so how much could I possibly
save, a few hundred pounds at the most?
Or am I missing something more obvious than that? This thing has the Cd of
a brick, but since it spends most of it's time below 40mph, I don't think
aerodynamics are going to improve things to any great extent. What changes
would you suggest, and not detract from the function or safety of the
vehicle?
Mark Brueggemann
Albuquerque, NM
S-10 EV
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I have the idea that Darin asked about the possibility to regen
into his pack, instead of into the 12V battery.
Since a good braking action can deliver just as many amps as a
mild take-off (at the same voltage), the only way get several
percents (on flat) to several tens of percents (in hills) of your
propulsion power back is if you charge it back into your pack.
Putting all that the regen into your 12V aux battery will either cook it
or simply limit your regen to insignificant amounts.
OK, assuming that the alternator is stout enough to take the
forces we are going to exert on it (this probably varies per
brand and model) the way to make it regen into your pack is:
- disconnect the 3phase wiring from the built-in diodes
(they are likely not up to the task, but you can check
with a high voltage diode and a lightbulb on 120V AC if the
diodes in your alternator can block that voltage. My bet is
they can't, so you better use external rectifiers.)
You'll need two bridges (or six diodes) if I am not mistaken
to feed the 3 alternator outputs into.
These must be high voltage (twice your pack) and high current.
Make sure to measure resistance between alternator housing and
the wires to verify they are now isolated.
- create a feedback circuit from the output of the rectifiers
to the field control using a resistor divider and an opto-
coupler to isolate the pack from the field drive.
- the connection from 12V aux battery to the field control
remains, so it will not blow up when trying to run it from
the pack.
The critical point is how to regulate the output current by
controlling the max allowed field current via the opto-coupler
on the measurement of the pack voltage (avoid cooking the pack
when it is still full) and the actual field current setting
via a regen-control, such as a potbox on the brake pedal.
It is not a difficult circuit, though. Maybe one transistor,
4 resistors and a zener diode plus the opto-coupler.
Note that you'll need a DC/DC converter to keep the 12V aux
battery charged.
Cor van de Water
Systems Architect
Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
Second Life: www.secondlife.com/?u=3b42cb3f4ae249319edb487991c30acb
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Lee Hart
Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2007 10:33 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Controlling an alternator (without wrecking it)?
From: "Darin
> I've read a few posts in the archive about using a tailshaft-connected
> alternator for a basic kind of regen... To keep things simple, let's
> assume this question is about 12v regen. Is it as simple as finding
> the alternator's field wire and feeding it something between zero to
> 12v to get the desired output?
Pretty close. You don't cut the field wire itself; you find the wire that is
sensing the battery voltage, and change its circuit.
Most alternators have a built-in voltage regulator; it tries to maintain
about 14v output regardless of RPM. You need to modify the voltage regulator
so you can change its voltage. The simplest scheme would be to have two
setpoints; 12v when the brakes are off, and 14v when you step on the brake
pedal.
The 12v system would be powered only by the 12v battery during normal
driving. The battery will run down. But when you step on the brakes, the
brake light switch switches the alternator to 14v. Since the battery will be
at 13v or less, the alternator goes to its full output, trying to bring the
12v battery up to 14v as quickly as possible. If it's a 60amp alternator,
you get about 14v x 60a = 840 watts. Since alternators are about 60%
efficient, this loads the traction motor at about 1.9 horsepower. That would
produce modest "engine braking".
> Are there any implications (for alternator life) of switching the
> field in and out while the alternator is spinning merrily away?
You don't switch the field itself; you switch the control signal that the
regulator is using to sense battery voltage.
--
Lee Hart
--- End Message ---
