EV Digest 6623
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: Arc Flash & Ark Blast Warning !!!!!
by Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: electricity from ordinary air spiced with small amounts of hydrogen
and offers significant potential
by GWMobile <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) RE: Charger/Battery Recommedations (Was:Killing my Batteries Thread)
by "David Hankins" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: Arc Flash & Ark Blast Warning !!!!!
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) RE: Charger/Battery Recommedations (Was:Killing my Batteries Thread)
by "Roger Stockton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) RE: plug in prius conversion
by "Roger Stockton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Re: Anybody have schematic for an $8 voltage clamper/limiter, said
to work well?
by Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) S-10 Conversion Transmission
by Daniel Eyk <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Re: 600A for 40 seconds - battery recommendations?
by "Scott Littledike" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) RE: Arc Flash & Ark Blast Warning !!!!!
by Cor van de Water <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Re: S-10 Conversion Transmission
by Mark Brueggemann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) RE: Motor recommendations
by "childreypa" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Re: S-10 Conversion Transmission
by MIKE WILLMON <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re: Motor temp
by James Massey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Basic rectification question
by Frank John <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Re: plug in prius conversion
by <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Need Controller suggestion for Motor
by Michael Barkley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Insurance
by "Eidson, Mark" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Flight of the ForkenSwift (and video)
by "Darin - at - metrompg.com" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) Re: [EV] Flight of the ForkenSwift (and video)
by Eduardo Kaftanski <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Re: Insurance
by Bob Bath <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) Re: Bob Schneveis' Walking Electric Chariot
by Lock Hughes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) Re: Insurance
by "mike young" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
Careful here:
The current required to sustain the arc is lower (can be far lower)
than normal driving current. No fuse will blow once the arc has
started - the fuse will see "normal" current flow.
I have few holes burned on a cushion of the passenger seat to prove it.
In fact, Don, you can see those holes right now...
Victor
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Not a bad idea but I looked up FRN fuses and it said they were a delay type.
Would they be fast enough to stop this from happening?
Don
In a message dated 3/31/2007 8:36:33 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
I usually put a fuse in middle of the battery string such as a "FRN" type.
This can be sized to never blow except for catastrophic cases like the one
described. Flange type fuses can be drilled and mounted on home made base
without an expensive fuseholder, since they will only be infrequently if
ever changed.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
No it is a true article as far as a I know
On Mon, 2 Apr 2007 9:28 am, KARSTEN GOPINATH wrote:
Was this supposed to be dated April 1st? 8-)
On Apr 2, 2007, at 2:03 AM, Geopilot wrote:
Cars Running on Electricity from Atmospheric Hydrogen
Category: SOFTPEDIA NEWS :: Science :: Nano-Biotechnology
Bacteria powered biofuel cell
By: Lucian Dorneanu, Science Editor
Hydrogen Car
Enlarge picture
Researchers at the Oxford University have developed a pioneering
“biofuel cell” that produces electricity from ordinary air spiced
with small amounts of hydrogen and offers significant potential as
an inexpensive and renewable alternative to the costly platinum-based
fuel cells that have dominated discussion about the “hydrogen
economy” of the future.
Hydrogen fuel-cell technology sounds almost too good to be true. You
combine cheap and plentiful hydrogen and oxygen gas, the fuel cell
generates electricity and the by-product is simply water. But it’s a
little more involved.
The key is a proton exchange membrane, or PEM, containing platinum.
The platinum acts as a catalyst that separates electrons from the
hydrogen gas atoms. The free electrons are gathered as current and the
positively charged hydrogen ions pass through the membrane where they
readily combine with oxygen atoms to form water. But if the hydrogen
gas contains impurities, such as water vapor or carbon monoxide, it
can damage the fuel cell’s separation membrane, dropping efficiency
or stopping the process altogether.
Another disadvantage is the fact that as a precious metal, platinum is
in short supply, raising questions about the sustainability of
platinum-based fuel cell technology. Platinum is more costly than
gold, with recent prices topping $1,000 per ounce
Pure hydrogen is also hard to come by, so the team built the biofuel
cell with hydrogenases — enzymes from naturally occurring bacteria
that use or oxidize hydrogen in their metabolism.
The cell consists of two electrodes coated with the enzymes placed
inside a container of ordinary air with 3 percent added hydrogen and
uses enzymes from Ralstonia metallidurans (R. metallidurans), an
ancient bacterium believed to have been one of the first forms of life
on Earth. It evolved 2.5 billion years ago, when there was no oxygen
in Earth’s atmosphere, and survived by metabolizing hydrogen.
Fraser Armstrong, Ph.D. at the Oxford University, pointed out that
naturally occurring hydrogenase enzymes can be produced at lower cost,
with carbon-monoxide poisoning not being a problem. Since the
hydrogenases are chemically selective and tolerant, they work in
mixtures of hydrogen and oxygen, avoiding the need for expensive
fuel-separation membranes required in other types of fuel cells.
Hydrogenases also work at about the same rate as platinum-based
catalysts, but in the current version of the cell the only
disadvantage is the fact that the enzyme is not attached tightly to
the electrode and the cell runs for only about two days.
Now, the researchers are investigating the use of enzymes from other
organisms for more practical results that could be implemented in
future car manufacturing processes.
www.GlobalBoiling.com for daily images about hurricanes, globalwarming
and the melting poles.
www.ElectricQuakes.com daily solar and earthquake images.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
>Nicads! Try the BB-600s! ;-)
Any ideas for some possible sources for the bb600s?
I can't find them anywhere, My local Batteries plus says "not interested",
Google search is zero and Marathon won't return my emails.
[snip]
>David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
>EV List Administrator
David Hankins
EV wanabe
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
From: Victor Tikhonov
> The current required to sustain the arc is lower (can be far
> lower) than normal driving current. No fuse will blow once the
> arc has started - the fuse will see "normal" current flow.
Victor is right; you can sustain an arc with quite a low current under the
right (or wrong!) circumstances. The current is limited when you have a larger
spacing, or a small surface area on the two surface that the arc is flowing
between.
When you are protecting a battery pack against shorts, it's likely that two
metal surfaces will be large (like battery cables), and get pushed very close
together (or even touch) to strike the arc. Unless or until something widens
that gap or reduces the area, the current will be *very* high, and so blow the
fuse. This would be the case if, for example, you pinched a pair of heavy wires
together so it cut through the insulation.
On the other hand, the arc might get started by dropping a small piece of wire
or a tool onto a battery. The arc could be struck, but then the wire rapidly
burns back or the tool moves to create a long thin arc. In this case, the arc
could easily draw a low enough current not to blow a fuse. You can have a
sustained DC arc with only milliamps of current!
--
"Those who say it cannot be done should not interrupt the one who is
doing it." -- Chinese proverb
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
David Roden wrote:
> On 1 Apr 2007 at 15:02, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> > What ideal Lead-Acid Battery and Charger combo do you
> > folks recommend and why? THANKS!
> For the charger, I'd look into using two Delta-Q chargers.
> Roger, can you supply two 60v nominal chargers? Maybe
> even a single 120 volt model? I seem to recall that they
> can do DV/DT.
Yes, we have a growing selection of algorithms that allow our 72V
charger to handle 60V packs. The chargers can do dv/dt and just about
anything else one can dream up. Unfortunately, we don't offer a 120V
model at this time.
My personal suggestion to the original poster is to switch to Trojan's
T1275 12V flooded battery. This allows him to stick with 12V floodeds,
but gets him into a true deep cycle battery. If the task of converting
the vehicle to 8V floodies isn't too daunting, and the cost is
attractive vs the T1275s, this would result in more energy onboard and
could translate into greater cycle life due to the shallower depth of
discharge ('course, the performance will suffer).
I wouldn't ditch the Zivan too quickly. Their reputation for
overcharging is based on using them with sealed batteries, but as long
as you keep an eye on the water this isn't nearly as much an issue with
floodeds. The NG1 actually erred on the side of slightly undercharging
SCS225/30XHS type batteries, in my experience, but I don't know how the
NG3 fares. The T1275s want to be charged more like T105s than group
31s, since they are based on the same plates as the T105, so the NG3
might need a different algorithm than has been being used with the
SCS225s.
Anyone running floodeds should really take advantage of their ability to
monitor the specific gravities to see how the batteries and charger are
doing. I find a temperature-compensated refractometer *much* faster and
nicer than any hydrometer for this, and use and recommend the Misco
7064VP+ or 7084VP+:
<http://www.misco.com/traditional-hand-refractometer.html>.
Cheers,
Roger.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Doug Hartley wrote:
> A Delta-Q charger could be available for about
> $500 -$600. but I will let Roger comment on
> that if he is able to.
Not sure what there is for me to comment on ;^>
Certainly, Delta-Q chargers are available with algorithms for the
Valence batteries, and $500-600 is a typical price for the charger, to
the best of my knowledge.
Cheers,
Roger.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Would that work for you?:
http://www.metricmind.com/ac_honda/images/clamper.jpg
You will need to re-adjust it for 12V operation and use
larger heat sink as the power dissipation for the same clamping
current is about 4x of that for LiIons I originally designed it for.
This thing is few years old and today I probably would do it
differently, but it works and likely have <$8 parts in it (if you manage
to make/find heat sinks for cheap and [optionally] forget about
opto-coupler).
Good luck,
Victor
--
'91 ACRX - something different
From: robert mat
Anybody have schematic for an $8 voltage clamper/limiter,
said to work well?
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
This has probably been covered, but is there any
advantage of the 5-speed transmission over the
4-speed in this convesion? As I understand it, you
only use about 3 speeds and maybe 4th on the freeway?
Is that correct? I will be using an ADC 9", DCP 600
controller and a 144 volt pack to start with. I will
have freeway travel for about half the trip each way
as well as climbing from Oregon across the Columbia
River to Washington for about 2-3 miles one way. I
have both 4 and 5 speed available to use.
Thanks, Dan Eyk
Daniel Eyk
Vancouver, Wa.
Electric S-10 project
E-15 project
____________________________________________________________________________________
No need to miss a message. Get email on-the-go
with Yahoo! Mail for Mobile. Get started.
http://mobile.yahoo.com/mail
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Many thanks for the suggestions on this. I have looked at all of the
recommendations:
Hawker Cells/monoblocks, these are rated at about 50 -65 Amps at a discharge
to 1.5VPC - so 10 in parallel x 54 2v cells = 210 lbs - good battery but too
heavy.
Nicads are the second best choice, CP2400SCR are 30A but i have read they
can take 60A. at 1.1VPC i would need 10 in parallel, x 70 cells = about
45kg, not bad! I also found some good nimh RC car batteries that you can
pull 30A from. However, the cost of 700 cells is about £3000.
I compared with A123 lithiums and have been amazed.. 10 of these in parallel
are good for 700A, i assume them to sag to about 2.3VPC (anyone advise on
the sag at 70A? i was sort of guessing based on the graph on their website),
so 180 - 250 cells would easily do the job, costing £1800 to £2500 - the
cheapest option! and weighing a tinnnnyy 20kg.
so my next question is, how do you charge A123 cells - can you buy an off
the shelf charger, or do you need to get one made.. is it possible to
fabricate one yourself etc.. i also know nothing about balancing, how you do
this and if its necessary with lithiums?
Thankyou very much to everyone who has replied!
Scott
_________________________________________________________________
Txt a lot? Get Messenger FREE on your mobile.
https://livemessenger.mobile.uk.msn.com/
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Same as today - water.
(Unless you still use the old oil-based paints)
Cor van de Water
Systems Architect
Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
Second Life: www.secondlife.com/?u=3b42cb3f4ae249319edb487991c30acb
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Bob Rice
Sent: Monday, April 02, 2007 9:30 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Arc Flash & Ark Blast Warning !!!!!
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom Parker" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, April 02, 2007 4:49 AM
Subject: Re: Arc Flash & Ark Blast Warning !!!!!
> On Sat, 2007-03-31 at 03:11 -0400, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> > Yesterday I had my first and hope last flash arc experience. It was
such an
> > astounding event I Google to learn more about what happened. Words do
not
> > even come close to describing it. It was about as loud as a large m-60
> > firecracker, blinding bright, and a very very hot expanding explosion.
>
> People have poo-pooed your warning, saying that couldn't happen or an ev
> situation couldn't be as bad as your references suggest.
>
> Would you care to describe the results of your incident and what caused
> it?
>
> How many and what sort of batteries? What sort of conductors? What
> vaporised? How far were you thrown by the explosion? Did it happen
> inside? If so, is the building still standing?
>
> I've been listening here for nearly a year, and I've heard of a couple
> of different shorted optima incidents. I'm quite willing to believe a
> whole pack of batteries would make a highly unpleasant short circuit.
Sure does, even floodies give you great smoke shows!
> Can you describe what you would do differently to prevent the initial
> short circuit? If the initial short circuit had occurred anyway, would
> fuses or circuit breakers arrest the explosion?
> Yeah! Setup your battery pack with a few fuses around the car, so,
pulling them, you knock the power level down to, say 30 volt pieces. As
Steve sez; tape or shrink tube your half inch tightning wrench. Don't "
Refuze" til ALL the work on the Hot lines is done! Stay away from the full
line voltage. Well, DUH! But think your steps as you go. Think"Live" unless
you have disconnected stuff. Remember the cute bumper stickers on the CT
Light and Power trux" It isn't Dead, til it's Grounded"That MAY be an
extreame here, but I see it around, alot on their vehicles.
And just BE CAREFUL! I"M SHOUTING, HERE, I KNOW. BUT NO SHORT
CIRCUSES,PLEASE! But I think of it like you accept gasoline as a common use
thing? That shit is BAD! A good spark and WHOOMPH! You have a fire, til it
burns off. But we sorta know HOW to use it and accept the risks! Hah! When
we go ALL electric what are we gunna use to clean paintbrushes with??
My two watts worth
Bob
>
>
> --
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.1.413 / Virus Database: 268.18.24/741 - Release Date: 3/31/07
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
--- Daniel Eyk <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> This has probably been covered, but is there any
> advantage of the 5-speed transmission over the
> 4-speed in this convesion?
...
> I will be using an ADC 9", DCP 600 controller and a
> 144 volt pack to start with.
This is exactly my setup with my S-10, and I have the 4-speed.
Occasionally you need 1st to get off the line, or crawl up
a steep driveway. I normally leave it in 2nd all the time
and drive it like an automatic, is good for 0-45mph in
daily driving. 3rd is used on the freeway 45-80mph.
I've never used 4th since I converted it. If you can
come up with a gear ratio chart between the two, maybe
you can correlate what this would mean in a 5 speed.
I'm pretty sure my differential is a 3.83.
Mark "EV Basher" Brueggemann
Albuquerque, NM
S-10 EV
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Ian Hooper
Sent: Saturday, March 31, 2007 6:04 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Motor recommendations
>Hi all,
>I've been planning to use a Warp9 in my MX5/Miata conversion, but now
>that the time to actually buy the motor approaches I thought I should
>run this selection by the experts..
>OK, so I'll be running a 160V nominal LFP lithium battery pack rated
>at up to 900 amps short term, and am building a controller rated to
>around 1000 (battery) amps continuous. Given the opportunity, would a
>single Warp9 ever draw this much current? If not, anyone recommend
>alternatives?
You mentioned building a contactor controller. I have looked as hard as
I can for information on building one. I found a little information, but
I really need a detailed schematic and walkthrough. A how to page would
be perfect but all I can find are some bits and pieces on the theory.
Everyone says they have built one or are going to, but I can't find much
good info. I would love some info on how you plan to build yours if
that's possible.
Paul
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
the 5 speed in my Mitsu is about the same. I do 0-45 mph in 2nd and 3rd up to
85 mph.
> Mark Brueggemann wrote:
>
> This is exactly my setup with my S-10, and I have the 4-speed.
> Occasionally you need 1st to get off the line, or crawl up
> a steep driveway. I normally leave it in 2nd all the time
> and drive it like an automatic, is good for 0-45mph in
> daily driving. 3rd is used on the freeway 45-80mph.
> I've never used 4th since I converted it. If you can
> come up with a gear ratio chart between the two, maybe
> you can correlate what this would mean in a 5 speed.
> I'm pretty sure my differential is a 3.83.
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
At 09:31 AM 2/04/07 -0600, Roland wrote:
To monitor the motor temperature components from the commutator, brushes
and field windings, a person can use a non-contact infrared temperature
probe that can be use with a DMM or a temperature meter such as a Fluke
Model 80T-IR.
I was thinking of using a transparent port in the brush cover and mount this
unit to monitor the commutator temperatures.
G'day Roland, All
Although DMM accessories and hand-held infra-red thermometers are a useful
tool, they'd be almost impossible to use for testing other than on a dyno.
I have set up several IR thermometer transmitters over the years, one of
those would be very useful for condition monitoring, mounted in the brush
cover (assuming its' field of view missed the brush gear) with a remote
display.
You would not be able to use a perspex cover over the commutator, with the
IR thermometer outside, as the thermometer would just give you the
temperature of the perspex.
As the Maritime College motor is in part an academic exercise, they want
all thermal readings to be as accurate as practical, and (more
significantly) to have very low errors between the different sensors. To
this end I'm using type J thermocouples, all made from the one batch of
wire. They can take care of maintaining the wire type through to their
measurement instrument (for those who don't know, if you use normal wire
instead of thermocouple wire to extend the sensor of a thermocouple you
introduce an error equal to the difference between the temperature where
the instrument is and where the copper to thermocouple connection is made).
Using slip rings and brushes to bring out a thermocouple signal from the
rotor will introduce an error equivalent to the temperature difference
between one side of the brushes to the other. Since they are chasing
accuracy, I think that this will not be suficiently accurate.
Jeff has provided a method using a wheatstone bridge (thanks Jeff) that the
college could use to make a predictive determination based on RPM, load
and/or values in other parts of the motor.
Regards
[Technik] James
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
What DC voltage would one see if 120VAC was rectified i.e. would it approach
170 or flatten out lower? Would adding sufficient capacitance tend to make it
rise? How would I calculate capacitor rating? I'm wondering if an alternator
(120 or possibly 240) could be used as an inexpensive higher-voltage generator.
Thanks,
Frank
____________________________________________________________________________________
Need Mail bonding?
Go to the Yahoo! Mail Q&A for great tips from Yahoo! Answers users.
http://answers.yahoo.com/dir/?link=list&sid=396546091
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Rich,
Thanks for your comments on the V-Boost PHEV description.
> Boy this sounds famillure..
That is what I thought when I saw your first postings on your PHEV work about a
year ago!
I had thought of the idea in September 2005. I placed an order in early
November 05 for an intelligent (microprocessor controlled and programmable to
follow the learning curve) boost converter based on an intelligent buck/boost
regulator that was then finishing its development phase. This PHEV project was
pushed one year behind first by a boost converter delivery 8 months later than
expected. Then it was not working/surviving at this application's operating
voltage. Consequently, I had to start over from scratch to develop this boost
converter myself in November 2006.
> Keep in mind the usefullness of lead Acid packs. it gets folks out there
> really taking Gas off line and using the Grid...
> If you make the battery pack stand alone.. then you just remove the Lead,
> and swap out to Lithium or..What ever fits the customers wishes.
Agreed. A low entry cost in lead, and flexible operating voltage ranges for
the boost converter make it easier to change and upgrade battery packs for both
our systems.
> All the other stuff.. can really add up the cost of install. Don't under
> estimate the costs of
> The little stuff.
> It's not little.
Ain't that the truth!
> Now I have to make 5 interlock boxes.. They are the relay boxes that flip
> you from Grid charge to PHEV drive mode. Under CAN-view control and pass the
> canview drive signals to the PFC charger. These little babies have about
> $600 worth of high reliability contactors in them. That's my cost mind
> you... This is a spendy box.. that basiciy does a cable change over that
> takes about 30 seconds if you do it by hand. Ryan and I ran all last year
> with the cheap Anderson conenctor version... I wish there was a easier
> way to flip 8 condcutors with 40 amps at over 240 volts DC.
>
> Most of this stuff is needed no matter how you do your Phev Prius.
If a separate charger is used instead, then much of the expensive stuff and
cabling to "flip you from Grid charge to PHEV drive mode" is not required, the
cabling becomes simpler, and the savings could then pay for a charger This
would likely be an isolated charger and a lower power one, of course, for that
dollar amount. The approach that provides the best value and results depends
on the weighting put on the various factors. If fast recharge and multiple
charge/discharge cycles per day is a priority for a particular customer, then
the double use of your high-power charger will likely be less expensive than
using a PFC charger with my V-Boost system.
> I have 3 PiPrius kits inprocess at the moment.. It's Fun to have a parking
> lot full of 'em.
I bet! It is great to learn of this in action...
You have my respect and appreciation for all that you are doing in the EV and
PHEV areas.
Best Regards,
Doug
>
> From: "Rich Rudman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Date: 2007/04/02 Mon PM 12:32:38 EDT
> To: <[email protected]>
> Subject: Re: plug in prius conversion
>
> Boy this sounds famillure..
Snip
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hello all:
I'm attempting to determine what electronic controller would be good to use
with the aircraft starter/generator that I have mounted in my 94' Mitsubishi
Eclipse. The following link will show you how it is wired in order to use it
as a motor. It's 10hp continuous @ 36vdc, up to 30hp continuous @ 96vdc. I'm
attempting to use it at 72vdc, as the car runs 25mph with just 24vdc directlly
applied to the motor, in 3rd gear. I'm shooting for around 60mph.
Motor wiring diagram: http://www.surpluscenter.com/Wire/W6-936.jpg
I have some documentation that suggests it is a shunt motor, other that says
series, it's looks like a sepex but the other terminal that looks like a field
terminal is never used. I do know that if a 50ohm/150watt rheostat is used
instead of the short jumper shown in the diagram, it controls the amount of
torque the motor puts out. I've not as of yet found an internal wiring
schematic, to truely know how it's wired. I'm hoping someone out in the group
is familiar, and could suggest a controller
Thanks in advance; Mike
Eclipse Conversion page:
www.texomaev.com-a.googlepages.com/mitsubishieclipseconversion
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I have just about completed a built from scratch electric motorcycle.
I've been looking for insurance coverage and have not found anything
specific. Does the list have any recommendations for insuring such a
vehicle? Thanks, me.
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Monday, April 02, 2007 1:24 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: plug in prius conversion
Hi Rich,
Thanks for your comments on the V-Boost PHEV description.
> Boy this sounds famillure..
That is what I thought when I saw your first postings on your PHEV work
about a year ago!
I had thought of the idea in September 2005. I placed an order in early
November 05 for an intelligent (microprocessor controlled and
programmable to follow the learning curve) boost converter based on an
intelligent buck/boost regulator that was then finishing its development
phase. This PHEV project was pushed one year behind first by a boost
converter delivery 8 months later than expected. Then it was not
working/surviving at this application's operating voltage.
Consequently, I had to start over from scratch to develop this boost
converter myself in November 2006.
> Keep in mind the usefullness of lead Acid packs. it gets folks out
> there really taking Gas off line and using the Grid...
> If you make the battery pack stand alone.. then you just remove the
> Lead, and swap out to Lithium or..What ever fits the customers wishes.
Agreed. A low entry cost in lead, and flexible operating voltage ranges
for the boost converter make it easier to change and upgrade battery
packs for both our systems.
> All the other stuff.. can really add up the cost of install. Don't
> under estimate the costs of The little stuff.
> It's not little.
Ain't that the truth!
> Now I have to make 5 interlock boxes.. They are the relay boxes that
flip
> you from Grid charge to PHEV drive mode. Under CAN-view control and
pass the
> canview drive signals to the PFC charger. These little babies have
about
> $600 worth of high reliability contactors in them. That's my cost mind
> you... This is a spendy box.. that basiciy does a cable change over
that
> takes about 30 seconds if you do it by hand. Ryan and I ran all last
year
> with the cheap Anderson conenctor version... I wish there was a
easier
> way to flip 8 condcutors with 40 amps at over 240 volts DC.
>
> Most of this stuff is needed no matter how you do your Phev Prius.
If a separate charger is used instead, then much of the expensive stuff
and cabling to "flip you from Grid charge to PHEV drive mode" is not
required, the cabling becomes simpler, and the savings could then pay
for a charger This would likely be an isolated charger and a lower
power one, of course, for that dollar amount. The approach that
provides the best value and results depends on the weighting put on the
various factors. If fast recharge and multiple charge/discharge cycles
per day is a priority for a particular customer, then the double use of
your high-power charger will likely be less expensive than using a PFC
charger with my V-Boost system.
> I have 3 PiPrius kits inprocess at the moment.. It's Fun to have a
parking
> lot full of 'em.
I bet! It is great to learn of this in action...
You have my respect and appreciation for all that you are doing in the
EV and PHEV areas.
Best Regards,
Doug
>
> From: "Rich Rudman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Date: 2007/04/02 Mon PM 12:32:38 EDT
> To: <[email protected]>
> Subject: Re: plug in prius conversion
>
> Boy this sounds famillure..
Snip
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Officially, Project ForkenSwift (AKA Joe Sixpack Metro) is kind of
stalled at the battery rack making stage. We had some bases made to
measure, but have been delayed by other things since February. So the
the various tabs & supports - all the bits needed to actually install
the racks in the car - have yet to be done.
Meanwhile, the weather has warmed up, the birds are singing, and we were
getting antsy knowing the first test drive was oh, so close. Heck, a
couple of days recently you could even work in the garage with the door
up and the sun shining in!
Blame it on the resulting spring fever, but this got us to thinking:
bah, who needs battery racks!?
So, against all better judgment - and breaking more rules in more books
than can be counted on both hands - on Friday we piled 36v worth of used
batteries inside the car, hooked everything together and glided out of
the garage on the ForkenSwift's inaugural electric drive. (Which
basically consisted of driving up and down the street in front of the
house until the batteries gave up.)
A momentous occasion best summed up as: slow! And: very fun!
Also got some great reactions from people in the neighbourhood, mainly
due to the near silence of the car. One guy working on a car in his own
driveway yelled (ironically): "HEY - WHY IS YOUR CAR SO QUIET?" as I
went by - which led to an impromptu roadside electric car show.
Of course, all was documented in glorious pixelated technicolour and
posted to YouTube:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bDERyAILOak
So thanks to all you listers who have answered my questions to date, or
otherwise contributed to threads that supply a mind-numbing volume of
information to my in-box most days.
Having progressed from total ignorance a year ago, to a heightened state
of partial ignorance today, the Project continues...
Darin
http://www.forkenswift.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
>
> A momentous occasion best summed up as: slow! And: very fun!
>
Congratulations!
I have a question... are you still using the 36/48-225 amp curtis?
can you tell me how you wired the potbox? I have the same one, I think,
as you have and have doubts on how to wire it...
this is mine:
http://www.nn.cl/Autos/EV/m-IMG_2938.JPG
http://www.nn.cl/Autos/EV/t-IMG_2936.JPG
thanks :)
--
Eduardo K. | Roses are #FF0000
http://www.carfun.cl | Violets are #0000FF
http://ev.nn.cl | All my base Are belong to you
|
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
In many respects, I'd just consider it like any other
EV:
a) Get a stated value policy, so that if a car takes
it out, you'll get the amount of the electronics, not
the amount that a Honda ___ gas burning motorcycle is
worth.
b) Few companies will insure a conversion, so options
will be limited. I'm with Allstate.
peace,
--- "Eidson, Mark" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I have just about completed a built from scratch
> electric motorcycle.
> I've been looking for insurance coverage and have
> not found anything
> specific. Does the list have any recommendations
> for insuring such a
> vehicle? Thanks, me.
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: Monday, April 02, 2007 1:24 PM
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: Re: plug in prius conversion
>
> Hi Rich,
>
> Thanks for your comments on the V-Boost PHEV
> description.
>
> > Boy this sounds famillure..
> That is what I thought when I saw your first
> postings on your PHEV work
> about a year ago!
> I had thought of the idea in September 2005. I
> placed an order in early
> November 05 for an intelligent (microprocessor
> controlled and
> programmable to follow the learning curve) boost
> converter based on an
> intelligent buck/boost regulator that was then
> finishing its development
> phase. This PHEV project was pushed one year behind
> first by a boost
> converter delivery 8 months later than expected.
> Then it was not
> working/surviving at this application's operating
> voltage.
> Consequently, I had to start over from scratch to
> develop this boost
> converter myself in November 2006.
>
> > Keep in mind the usefullness of lead Acid packs.
> it gets folks out
> > there really taking Gas off line and using the
> Grid...
> > If you make the battery pack stand alone.. then
> you just remove the
> > Lead, and swap out to Lithium or..What ever fits
> the customers wishes.
> Agreed. A low entry cost in lead, and flexible
> operating voltage ranges
> for the boost converter make it easier to change and
> upgrade battery
> packs for both our systems.
>
> > All the other stuff.. can really add up the cost
> of install. Don't
> > under estimate the costs of The little stuff.
> > It's not little.
> Ain't that the truth!
>
> > Now I have to make 5 interlock boxes.. They are
> the relay boxes that
> flip
> > you from Grid charge to PHEV drive mode. Under
> CAN-view control and
> pass the
> > canview drive signals to the PFC charger. These
> little babies have
> about
> > $600 worth of high reliability contactors in them.
> That's my cost mind
> > you... This is a spendy box.. that basiciy does a
> cable change over
> that
> > takes about 30 seconds if you do it by hand. Ryan
> and I ran all last
> year
> > with the cheap Anderson conenctor version... I
> wish there was a
> easier
> > way to flip 8 condcutors with 40 amps at over 240
> volts DC.
> >
> > Most of this stuff is needed no matter how you do
> your Phev Prius.
> If a separate charger is used instead, then much of
> the expensive stuff
> and cabling to "flip you from Grid charge to PHEV
> drive mode" is not
> required, the cabling becomes simpler, and the
> savings could then pay
> for a charger This would likely be an isolated
> charger and a lower
> power one, of course, for that dollar amount. The
> approach that
> provides the best value and results depends on the
> weighting put on the
> various factors. If fast recharge and multiple
> charge/discharge cycles
> per day is a priority for a particular customer,
> then the double use of
> your high-power charger will likely be less
> expensive than using a PFC
> charger with my V-Boost system.
>
> > I have 3 PiPrius kits inprocess at the moment..
> It's Fun to have a
> parking
> > lot full of 'em.
> I bet! It is great to learn of this in action...
>
> You have my respect and appreciation for all that
> you are doing in the
> EV and PHEV areas.
>
> Best Regards,
>
> Doug
>
> >
> > From: "Rich Rudman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > Date: 2007/04/02 Mon PM 12:32:38 EDT
> > To: <[email protected]>
> > Subject: Re: plug in prius conversion
> >
> > Boy this sounds famillure..
> Snip
> >
>
>
Converting a gen. 5 Honda Civic? My $20 video/DVD
has my '92 sedan, as well as a del Sol and hatch too!
Learn more at:
www.budget.net/~bbath/CivicWithACord.html
____
__/__|__\ __
=D-------/ - - \
'O'-----'O'-'
Would you still drive your car if the tailpipe came out of the steering wheel?
Are you saving any gas for your kids?
____________________________________________________________________________________
TV dinner still cooling?
Check out "Tonight's Picks" on Yahoo! TV.
http://tv.yahoo.com/
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
No way, peekay... "walking" ain't more efficient than rotary. HP is no
comparison without work x (over) time/distance.
Walking is "recipocal", like any piston, driven by steam, or gasoline
or diseasal...
Stop and go is NFG, compared to rotary.
*Spun* by magnets and electrons? Rules. No contest.
ps... IMHE (in my humble experience) 2/5 HP pushes me to 20kph. That
electric riskshaw looks like it'd take me all day long... TGT... that's
"to get there"... the important part of any commute :)
tks again
Lock
human-electric hybrid
Toronto
--- peekay <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> walking motion is more efficient than wheels .. says this
> professor .. his electric rickshaw uses a 5 lb motor and
> pulls 2 people easily
>
> does he have a website/email ?
>
> ..peekay
>
> (strange coincidence .. his rickshaw looks almost exactly
> like the rickshaws here in calcutta, india where i am presently
> located !)
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Roderick Wilde" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[email protected]>
> Sent: Friday, March 16, 2007 1:25 AM
> Subject: Bob Schneveis' Walking Electric Chariot
>
>
> > I know this has been mentioned on this list before and I have
> mentioned
> Bob
> > from time to time with quotes of his. This is a great video from
> You Tube
> > that I think is a must see.
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=45ZquJIolvY
> >
> > Roderick Wilde
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
here is 1 possible solution-as an example if it is a converted honda 750
just register and insure it as a honda 750 with no mention of ev conversion.
m young
----- Original Message -----
From: "Eidson, Mark" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, April 02, 2007 7:30 PM
Subject: Insurance
I have just about completed a built from scratch electric motorcycle.
I've been looking for insurance coverage and have not found anything
specific. Does the list have any recommendations for insuring such a
vehicle? Thanks, me.
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Monday, April 02, 2007 1:24 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: plug in prius conversion
Hi Rich,
Thanks for your comments on the V-Boost PHEV description.
Boy this sounds famillure..
That is what I thought when I saw your first postings on your PHEV work
about a year ago!
I had thought of the idea in September 2005. I placed an order in early
November 05 for an intelligent (microprocessor controlled and
programmable to follow the learning curve) boost converter based on an
intelligent buck/boost regulator that was then finishing its development
phase. This PHEV project was pushed one year behind first by a boost
converter delivery 8 months later than expected. Then it was not
working/surviving at this application's operating voltage.
Consequently, I had to start over from scratch to develop this boost
converter myself in November 2006.
Keep in mind the usefullness of lead Acid packs. it gets folks out
there really taking Gas off line and using the Grid...
If you make the battery pack stand alone.. then you just remove the
Lead, and swap out to Lithium or..What ever fits the customers wishes.
Agreed. A low entry cost in lead, and flexible operating voltage ranges
for the boost converter make it easier to change and upgrade battery
packs for both our systems.
All the other stuff.. can really add up the cost of install. Don't
under estimate the costs of The little stuff.
It's not little.
Ain't that the truth!
Now I have to make 5 interlock boxes.. They are the relay boxes that
flip
you from Grid charge to PHEV drive mode. Under CAN-view control and
pass the
canview drive signals to the PFC charger. These little babies have
about
$600 worth of high reliability contactors in them. That's my cost mind
you... This is a spendy box.. that basiciy does a cable change over
that
takes about 30 seconds if you do it by hand. Ryan and I ran all last
year
with the cheap Anderson conenctor version... I wish there was a
easier
way to flip 8 condcutors with 40 amps at over 240 volts DC.
Most of this stuff is needed no matter how you do your Phev Prius.
If a separate charger is used instead, then much of the expensive stuff
and cabling to "flip you from Grid charge to PHEV drive mode" is not
required, the cabling becomes simpler, and the savings could then pay
for a charger This would likely be an isolated charger and a lower
power one, of course, for that dollar amount. The approach that
provides the best value and results depends on the weighting put on the
various factors. If fast recharge and multiple charge/discharge cycles
per day is a priority for a particular customer, then the double use of
your high-power charger will likely be less expensive than using a PFC
charger with my V-Boost system.
I have 3 PiPrius kits inprocess at the moment.. It's Fun to have a
parking
lot full of 'em.
I bet! It is great to learn of this in action...
You have my respect and appreciation for all that you are doing in the
EV and PHEV areas.
Best Regards,
Doug
From: "Rich Rudman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: 2007/04/02 Mon PM 12:32:38 EDT
To: <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: plug in prius conversion
Boy this sounds famillure..
Snip
--- End Message ---
