Most bikers I know fix a flat without taking the whole wheel off.
The only moment I need to remove the wheel (or at least free one side
of the hub) is when the tire has gone bad and needs to be changed.
Fixing a flat is a matter of finding and patching the hole
(and what caused the hole, or you might have an immediate puncture again)

Cor van de Water
Chief Scientist
Proxim Wireless Corporation
Email: Private:
Skype: cor_van_de_water Tel: +1 408 383 7626

-----Original Message-----
From: EV [] On Behalf Of Peter Eckhoff via EV
Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2014 10:50 AM
To: Larry Gales; Electric Vehicle Discussion List
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Electric bike information

Hello Larry,

This is a nice summary and I did not see any errors.  I do have some 
comments that I think need to be addressed.   I also provided some of my 
experiences with respect to electric bikes but I am sure you have run 
across some of these experiences already.

One person I know rides a Currie Izip to and from work.  Her main goal 
is to get to work without having to take a shower.  She loves her bike 
for that ability and she rides on basically level ground with some small 
hills.  We are in the southeastern USA and just going to the mailbox in 
the summer can produce the feeling that you need a shower.  I can attest 
to the ability of an electric bike to climb long hills without 
generating heat stroke (but still need a shower).

I tried a geared bike and stripped a nylon(?) gear.  The bike, motor, 
lead acid pack and me weighed in over 300 pounds.   That is a lot of 
weight to put on the teeth of a nylon gear.  I bought a "bearing puller" 
to pull the two parts apart to get at the gear...   If I had to do it 
again, I would go with a non-geared bike.  The bike I bought was a 
conversion and used a heavier steel bike frame.

For an electric bike conversion, the gap between the forks has to be 
wide enough to receive a wheel with a motor encased between the spokes.  
If the gap is too narrow, bending the forks is not a good idea.  Most 
converters use a mountain bike frame.

Changing a flat on the motored wheel is problematic as you have to deal 
with the motor cable.  Some of the newer bikes have cable disconnects 
near the hub.  My conversion does not and I have to cut on plastic ties.

On one of the trails in the local area, I thought I was making great 
progress until I was passed by several people on road bikes at twice my 
speed.  Still, no complaints as I was able to go the distance with a bit 
to a lot of assist from the motor.

Your 15-25 pounds may be a little on the light side.  A quick glance at 
the Currie line up has their bikes at around 53 (w/o pedals) to 60 
pounds.  My son's "commuter" bike weighs in at 30 pounds.  Also, the 
electric bike frames tend to be sturdier (read heavier) to support the 
extra weight and stresses.  I would up your 15-25 pounds to maybe 20-30 
pounds.  (My bike weighs about 65+ pounds but it has a lead acid pack.)

You might also want to mention electric cargo bikes (Yuba Bikes, etc.).  
I rode an electric Yuba cargo bike and was impressed with how it felt 
more like a road bike when using the electric motor.

 >>  So the motor only operates when you pedal <<
My understanding is that the "motor only operates **after** you begin 
pedaling".  I think the manufacturer's were working on this because of 
the initial effort to begin pedaling was strenuous (especially uphill) 
until the motor kicked in.  The ideal was to have the motor kick in as 
you started pedaling.  Not sure of how much progress has been made in 
that regard.

Hope this helps.


On 8/26/2014 1:38 PM, Larry Gales via EV wrote:
> I am trying to interest the largest bicycle club in my area (Seattle), he
> Cascade Bicycle Club, about the importance and future of electric bikes.
> In July I wrote an article about the fun, practicality, and benefits of
> e-bikes, and now I would like to provide information that would help them
> purchase an e-bike or an e-bike kit.  So I want to know if the information
> that I give them is accurate.  So if you see any errors in the presentation
> below, let me know.
> Thanks,,
> Larry Gales,
> Here is the article (limited to 600 words):
> ======================================================
> In July I wrote an article in the "Courier" about the many advantages of
> electric bikes, or e-bikes, and how they are becoming a mainstream form of
> local transportation throughout Asia and Europe.  I hope to encourage
> people in this country to acquire e-bikes and so relieve us from the
> problems caused by the near exclusive use of automobiles.
> There are many aspects to consider when acquiring an e-bike:
>    o The method of purchase: buy a ready made e-bike or convert an
>      existing bike with a kit
>    o The odometer and battery state of charge display
>    o The power you need (typically 250 to 750 watts)
>    o The type and size of battery
>    o The type and location of the motor
>    o The wheel size compatible with an e-bike kit
>    o The weight of the e-bike, typically 15-25 lbs more than conventional
>      bikes, but note that with an e-bike, the weight only matters when
>      lift or carry it, so you can easily detach the battery, cutting the
>      additional weight to 8-12 lbs.
>    o The purchase cost and servicing of e-bikes
> Here we consider only the type, control, and placement of the electric
> motor in an e-bike.
>    o There are three main ways to control an e-bike motor:
>        - Pedelic:  this multiplies the power you apply to the pedals,
>          typically by 25% to 300%.  So the motor only operates when you
>          pedal
>        - Throttle:  the motor starts when you press the throttle.  You can
>          also pedal to add power or extend the range
>        - Both: many e-bikes provide both options
>    o There are two main types of e-bike motors:
>        - Mid-drive motor: this is a geared motor that drives the chain
>          wheel which in turns powers the chain that powers the rear wheel.
>          The main advantages are that the motor is isolated from the shock
>          and vibration of the wheel, and it operates in a way that is most
>          similar to the way a conventional bike works. However, it
>          requires frequent gear shifting which must be coordinated with the
>          motor controls
>        - Hub motor: this motor fits inside the wheel around the axle, and
>          is the most common e-bike motor.  The main advantages
>          are that it greatly reduces the wear and tear on the
>          drive train as it powers the wheel directly, it usually eliminates
>          the need to shift (if the motor is sufficiently powerful), it
>          often enables regenerating braking which can restore
>          10-20% of the battery charge, and adds a 3rd braking option.
>          Note that hub motors mounted in the front wheel cannot use
>          pedelic control.  There are two main types of hub motors:
>            * Gearless hub motor:  this is powered by a ring of rare earth
>              magnets that are electronically switched on and off to turn
>              the wheel. It has no moving parts and lasts longer with less
>              (usually no) maintenance than geared motors, it is the
>              quietest of all motors, and enables regenerative braking.
>              The main disadvantages are that it is larger and
>              somewhat heavier for the same power as a geared motor,  the
>              torque (needed for hill climbing) is about 20-30% less,
>              especially at very low speeds, for the same power rating as
>              a geared motor, and there may be a small amount of drag when
>              the motor is off.
>           * Geared hub motor:  this uses planetary gears.  It does not
>             cause any drag when the motor is off, has more torque and power
>             for a given weight than a gearless hub motor, but does not
>             (currently) allow regenerative braking. It is slightly noisier
>             than a gearless motor and requires more maintenance because it
> ​         ​
>    has moving parts.
> ​========================================================​

For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA 

For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA 

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