Yea, the Tesla didn’t have those features when purchased. They were removed after selling to a dealer. The dealer is the one who tricked this man into thinking he was getting FSD.
I have two Tesla’s and the are the beat cars I have ever owned and Tesla has promptly dealt with every issue I have had. Great standup company. Sent from my iPhone > On Feb 9, 2020, at 9:45 AM, Damon Henry <[email protected]> wrote: > > > Yes, but it is also being built by a well established automobile manufacturer > with a dealership near you who will sell you the car and not treat you like > they still own it. > > I believe I would take the Tesla over Niro, but there are some definite > downsides to dealing with Tesla. Some of them are only going to get worse > over time and possibly for second owners of vehicles. I'm not sure if I will > ever buy another brand new car (My 2001 Honda Insight is the only one so far) > as I prefer slightly used so I pay attention to what it is like to be a > second owner of a car. I read an article just this week about Tesla doing an > audit on a car that was sold to a person through a dealer with certain > features enabled which were then shutoff a few days after the car was > purchased used. While it is cool that Tesla can enhance their vehicles over > the air, the fact that it can work the other way around is a bit > disconcerting. If I buy something, I should be the owner. > > My next EV is likely to be a used OEM model, and the more that are on the > market, the better for me in terms of both price and selection. So here's > hoping Kia sells a ton of Niro's 🙂 > > Damon > From: EV <[email protected]> on behalf of paul dove via EV > <[email protected]> > Sent: Sunday, February 9, 2020 4:19 AM > To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <[email protected]> > Cc: paul dove <[email protected]>; brucedp5 <[email protected]> > Subject: Re: [EVDL] EVLN: $45k Niro 64kWh liquid-cooled EV> novices can drive > w/o learning EV-speak > > Wow that cost as much as a model 3 with 2/3rds the range > > Sent from my iPhone > > > On Feb 9, 2020, at 12:20 AM, brucedp5 via EV <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > https://nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.sandiegouniontribune.com%2Fcars%2Fstory%2F2020-02-02%2F2020-kia-niro-ev-239-miles-in-a-family-electric&data=02%7C01%7C%7C6536573ba83247a82f6e08d7ad6c0a38%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637168551850189462&sdata=FMWcPnOwMWq2Ve%2BTqYV3Sm6ETe6a9dyQsWeTpbLAmsQ%3D&reserved=0 > > 2020 Kia Niro EV: 239 miles in a family electric > > Feb. 2, 2020 Mark Maynard > > > > [images / kia > > https://nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fcalifornia-times-brightspot.s3.amazonaws.com%2Ffd%2F91%2Fcee2c5754721a2cf93f31806e9d1%2Fniroev-exterior.jpg&data=02%7C01%7C%7C6536573ba83247a82f6e08d7ad6c0a38%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637168551850189462&sdata=hyBdnzieCSCPe1PNfMvn9qOd5mEWr%2BJlEEPBOFsiXYU%3D&reserved=0 > > The Niro EV is sold in EX and EX Premium trim levels with starting prices of > > $39,545 and $45,045, including the $1,045 freight charge from Hwaseong, > > Korea > > > > https://nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fcalifornia-times-brightspot.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fd3%2Fe0%2Fb2c0c3e04299882b8ef1b04aa7d3%2Fniroev-frontseats.jpg&data=02%7C01%7C%7C6536573ba83247a82f6e08d7ad6c0a38%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637168551850199469&sdata=EJleqFQ4qKvVmzNnKZWZ6QZ8CYYlhflR0ZvNRcunXu8%3D&reserved=0 > > There is enough cabin width for the space to allow intuitive placement of > > controls. Sightlines are unobstructed > > > > https://nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fcalifornia-times-brightspot.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fdd%2Fc0%2F3ae1202c4a2190d3748da2c8d3fb%2Fniroev-gauges.jpg&data=02%7C01%7C%7C6536573ba83247a82f6e08d7ad6c0a38%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637168551850199469&sdata=BOASOow%2FlR2mFUuGpp%2FEAoOSGgcvxRAvKxD%2FzuZZ0cs%3D&reserved=0 > > The 7-inch gauge group has selectable views, including the driver’s > > efficiency rating > > > > https://nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fcalifornia-times-brightspot.s3.amazonaws.com%2F63%2Fa9%2F6edfcaf64d3b9c2a3d3a56282ca7%2Fniroev-centerstack.jpg&data=02%7C01%7C%7C6536573ba83247a82f6e08d7ad6c0a38%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637168551850199469&sdata=amBcuNhYqUwH6JHM7FMs5ttRmtysq%2FVmctVT4baEZ8o%3D&reserved=0 > > From top to bottom, the center stack is simple to see and access > > > > https://nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fcalifornia-times-brightspot.s3.amazonaws.com%2F1f%2F1a%2F039049f742a596fcd1d4b06bbaa6%2Fniroev-motor.jpg&data=02%7C01%7C%7C6536573ba83247a82f6e08d7ad6c0a38%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637168551850199469&sdata=gwRACGc6%2FZyhtt1bMz%2FwaOPN1l995LAyFsx%2BRbhXR4g%3D&reserved=0 > > The 201-horsepower, 356-volt permanent magnet synchronous motor put > > immediate power to the front wheels for brisk acceleration > > > > https://nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fcalifornia-times-brightspot.s3.amazonaws.com%2F15%2F3c%2Fe215cac74b0d90c619228edca71b%2Fniroev-chargeport.jpg&data=02%7C01%7C%7C6536573ba83247a82f6e08d7ad6c0a38%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637168551850199469&sdata=czNaavDZC3cZqAaTNglIipU2I1b7%2FAiHCuW8bPw6454%3D&reserved=0 > > The onboard 7.2 kW charging system includes DC fast-charging, which Kia says > > can add around 100 miles in 30 minutes. But charging at home on 120 volts > > would take 59 hours! > > > > https://nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fcalifornia-times-brightspot.s3.amazonaws.com%2F10%2Fd5%2F66f1f0994bfdb9a7e8d7ac346895%2Fniroev-backseats.jpg&data=02%7C01%7C%7C6536573ba83247a82f6e08d7ad6c0a38%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637168551850199469&sdata=S6b0dz6NLRzIkkd7s3c5QWBa5G7OK9y17OJs8dsCbvk%3D&reserved=0 > > Back seat space is adequate for adults with cramped foot room under the > > front seats but good legroom at 36 inches > > > > https://nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fcalifornia-times-brightspot.s3.amazonaws.com%2F85%2F25%2F3d8ea014453ea6c1a0b5b426782f%2Fniroev-cargo.jpg&data=02%7C01%7C%7C6536573ba83247a82f6e08d7ad6c0a38%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637168551850199469&sdata=AvuvlhlGqjhLEO3su1FygaJt4VNhs2d7rsjjZLUQ2%2FI%3D&reserved=0 > > Cargo space of 18.5 cubic feet behind the back seat has a short load-in > > height of 27 inches but it’s wide at 4.5 feet, with at least five feet of > > length with the 60/40 seatback folded, or 53 cu. ft. The charging cable can > > be stored below the cargo floor > > > > https://nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fcalifornia-times-brightspot.s3.amazonaws.com%2F3c%2F62%2F8af61f85477f96fbd22098fc34aa%2Fniroev-rear.jpg&data=02%7C01%7C%7C6536573ba83247a82f6e08d7ad6c0a38%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637168551850209477&sdata=%2ByGBqZMzM3Srl30VRsqOO4flvstw%2BrD0kOxkLBjjf%2FQ%3D&reserved=0 > > Because Kia has not met its EV sales quota for rebates, buyers will receive > > the full $7,500 federal tax credit. And it qualifies for access to > > high-occupancy vehicle lanes, with a decal > > ] > > > > It’s a well-done car that happens to be electric > > > > It was interesting to learn that Kia considered me only 6 percent normal on > > my first drive in its Niro EV. The better news was that I was 94 percent > > “economical.” But my enthusiast’s card was revoked for a zero-percent > > aggressive driving report. > > > > That’s according to the onboard driving gauge to coach and prod drivers to > > make the most of the Niro EV’s 239 miles of driving range. > > > > The Niro is a family of electrified compact-class, five-door hatchbacks, > > including a gasoline-electric hybrid, a plug-in hybrid (with 26 miles of > > battery range), and the battery-electric that launched, new for 2019. For > > 2020, the hybrid and plug-in get some minor updates, but the Niro continues > > unchanged. > > > > The updated 2020 hybrid model will go on sale soon; pricing has not been > > announced but the 2019 model ranged from $24,000-$33,000 in five trim > > levels. PHEV pricing starts at about $29,000-$36,000 in three trim levels. > > > > The Niro is also in the Hyundai-Kia family of EVs, including the Hyundai > > Kona and Ioniq and Kia Soul. Niro shares elements of all, but it is a little > > larger overall with comfortable head and elbow room. > > > > It also will be compared to the Chevrolet Bolt, Nissan Leaf and Tesla Model > > 3 [EVs], but its back-seat room and cargo space are its physical separators. > > And other selling points will be the Niro’s primarily premium presentation > > in the cabin and layers of details and clever features. > > > > The Niro’s styling and ease of use are more like a traditional automobile > > with familiar controls and functions. A novice can get in and drive without > > learning EV-speak. > > > > Sold in EX and EX Premium trim levels, the Niro EV has starting prices of > > $39,545 and $45,045, including the $1,045 freight charge from Hwaseong, > > Korea. (Currently, the Niro EV is sold in only 12 states: California, > > Connecticut, Hawaii, Georgia, Maryland, Massachusetts, New Jersey, New York, > > Oregon, Rhode Island, Washington and Texas). Kia has not said when or if it > > will go nationwide. > > > > And because Kia has not met its EV sales quota for rebates, buyers will > > receive the full $7,500 federal tax credit. > > > > But the California Air Resources Board has lowered the state rebates for > > fully electric vehicles costing $60,000 and more from $2,500 to $2,000, and > > the rebate for plug-in hybrids drops from $1,500 to $1,000. Rebates for low- > > to moderate-income buyers will stay at $4,500 for EVs, $3,500 for plug-in > > hybrids and $7,000 for fuel-cell vehicles. > > > > Ownership still qualifies for access to high-occupancy vehicles lanes, with > > a Clean Air Vehicle decal from the DMV. > > > > Liquid cooled > > > > The Niro EV’s 64 kWh lithium ion polymer battery is liquid-cooled and > > packaged under the floor. The array of battery pouches shaves about two > > inches of space from the cargo floor and crimps back-seat foot space under > > the front seats, but legroom is adult-adequate at 36 inches. > > > > The onboard 7.2 kW charging system includes DC fast-charging, which Kia says > > can add around 100 miles in 30 minutes or 80 percent of battery capacity in > > 75 minutes. > > > > But charging at home on 120 volts would take 59 hours! Owners will want to > > buy (and pay to have installed) the Level 2 (240 volt) home charger for > > faster charging of about 9.5 hours for a depleted battery. Most owners don’t > > run the battery to a state of deadness and prefer to set a timer for reduced > > charging cost to have a fully charged car for the morning commute. > > > > Kia does not offer dealer support for the installation of a Level 2 charger > > at home. But it does have an arrangement with Amazon for what it says is a > > no-hassle home charging installation service. > > Drivability > > > > The Niro is a comfortable commuter and well soundproofed. It isn’t > > sport-tuned, but neither is it a volt-dolt. Despite a curb weight of 3,854 > > pounds — 1,000 of which are the battery — it does not feel heavy to drive; > > some EVs struggle to balance hefty curb weights and can feel loaded. Its > > Pedestrian Warning Sound is a muted electronic chorale as if from an > > interstellar jazz bar. > > > > Among its many standard features is Kia Drive Wise, a safety suite of > > advanced driver-assistance systems. Among the technologies are > > forward-collision warning and forward-collision avoidance assist, > > lane-departure warning and lane-keeping assist, blind-spot collision > > warning, smart cruise control with stop and go, and rear cross-traffic > > collision warning. > > > > The Niro’s turning circle is urban-dainty at 34.8 feet and sightlines are > > unobstructed, with the added benefit of a 7-inch display for the rearview > > camera. > > > > The 201-horsepower, 356-volt motor and single speed gear-reduction > > transmission put immediate power to the front wheels for brisk acceleration. > > But there’s also good power in the midrange to hold your place in the > > commute. Four drive modes — Eco, Normal, Sport and Eco+ — automatically > > adjust regenerative braking level, air conditioning and heating settings. > > > > Using a firm foot, braking is confident from four-wheel discs, with 12-inch > > vented front rotors and 11.8-inch solid rotors rear. And the regenerative > > function on accelerator lift-off is three-stage driver selectable through > > tabs on the steering column, repurposed from manual shift levers. Punch it > > up for max regen or dial it back to be kind to passengers’ necks. The > > all-season 17-inch Michelin Primacy MXV4s (215/55) have aerodynamic alloy > > wheels; with an inflator kit for flats. > > > > Smart designs > > > > Front headroom is tall at 40.1 inches in an open cabin design. The > > instrument panel is smartly designed for intuitive use and reach of the > > touch screen and audio-map-media controls. Just below is another tier for > > climate controls. > > > > The cabin has a range of usable storage areas, including a floor shelf below > > the shift console; a huge cupholder “well” with adjustable grips; bottle and > > stash space in the door panels; and a charging e-bin with a > > wireless-charging pad, two USBs (one for charging) and a 180-watt 12-volt. > > > > The EX Premium has luxury appeal in its stitched and perforated > > leather-trimmed upholstery, heated and vented front seats, heated steering, > > sunroof, interior “mood” lighting and power driver’s seat. > > > > A low hump to the center tunnel allows decent foot space for three across > > seating. There is a fold-down armrest but no charging ports. > > Cargo > > > > Cargo space of 18.5 cubic feet behind the back seat has a cropped load-in > > height of 27 inches, but it’s wide at 4½ feet, with at least 5 feet of > > length with the 60/40 seatback folded, for 53 cu. ft. The charging cable can > > be stored below the cargo floor. > > > > The Niro is a well-done car that happens to be electric — and Kia sends it > > home with an EV System Warranty of 10 years or 100,000 miles. > > > > 2020 Kia Niro EV EX Premium > > > > Body style: compact, front-drive 5-passenger hatchback > > Motor: 201-hp, 356-volt permanent magnet synchronous; 291 lb.-ft. torque > > from 0-3,600 rpm > > Battery: liquid-cooled 64 kWh Lithium ion polymer battery, 170kW > > Transmission: single speed gear reduction > > Range: 239 miles; mpg equivalent, 123/102/112 mpg city/hwy/combined > > Charging times: 59 hours, 120-volt home; 9:35 hours Level 2; 1:15 hours > > DC fast charge > > > > SPECIFICATIONS > > Cargo space: 18.5-53 cu. ft. > > Front head/leg room: 40.1/41.7 in. > > Rear head/leg room: 37.7/36 in. > > Length/wheelbase: 172.2/106.3 in. > > Curb weight: 3,854 lbs. > > Turning circle: 34.8 ft. > > > > FEATURES > > Standard equipment includes: wireless phone charging, electric parking > > brake, 8-inch color navigation touchscreen, power tilt/slide sunroof, LED > > headlights, 8-speaker Harman/Kardon audio system with external amplifier and > > subwoofer, heated steering wheel, LED interior lighting, ambient mood > > lighting, lighted door-sill scuff plates > > > > Safety features include: 7 air bags, parking distance alerts (forward > > and reverse) and “Kia Drive Wise” suite of advanced driver-assistance > > systems, automatic emergency braking > > > > PRICING > > Base price: $45,045, including $1,045 freight charge; price as tested > > $47,155 > > > > Options on test vehicle: Cold weather package $1,080, adds battery > > heater and heat pump; EX Premium Launch Edition, $1,000, adds heated > > steering wheel, LED headlights, auto-dimming rearview mirror, park distance > > warnings, front and rear; cargo cover $95; carpeted floor mats $135; cargo > > net $50 > > > > Where assembled: Hwaseong, Korea > > Warranty: 10 years/100,000 powertrain and battery; 5 years/60,000 miles > > bumper to bumper with roadside assistance > > [© sandiegouniontribune.com] > > > > > > + > > https://nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.arabianindustry.com%2Futilities%2Fnews%2F2020%2Ffeb%2F1%2Ftotal-saft-to-launch-221-mn-plant-to-manufacture-european-ev-batteries-6315738%2F&data=02%7C01%7C%7C6536573ba83247a82f6e08d7ad6c0a38%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637168551850209477&sdata=4Fw77MdNz17EO1Q3m5B1GQrA5qpgolN%2BHKzW4b0fuWA%3D&reserved=0 > > Total, Saft, to launch $221 mn plant to manufacture European EV batteries > > 1 February 2020 ... highest level of energy performance, both ... range > > &charging ... lower carbon footprint ... setting a new standard in Europe > > ... Automotive Cell Company (ACC) ... a 50-50 Saft & Groupe PSA/Opel joint > > venture for the pilot production ... > > https://nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.arabianindustry.com%2Fstatic%2Fcontent%2Fimages%2Flarger1%2F14443-535622.jpg&data=02%7C01%7C%7C6536573ba83247a82f6e08d7ad6c0a38%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637168551850209477&sdata=o4nyWR%2FcxA9zC5Bd7Su2vclD%2FwcwOQOe%2BPMUv9gnF3M%3D&reserved=0 > > > > > > > > > > For EVLN EV-newswire posts use: > > https://nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.evdl.org%2Farchive%2F&data=02%7C01%7C%7C6536573ba83247a82f6e08d7ad6c0a38%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637168551850209477&sdata=dgc9G1sMY51pGt3TuNzpBsTfJzwpSKGhkir6GpTP3l8%3D&reserved=0 > > > > > > {brucedp.neocities.org} > > > > -- > > Sent from: > > https://nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Felectric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com%2F&data=02%7C01%7C%7C6536573ba83247a82f6e08d7ad6c0a38%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637168551850209477&sdata=Yo6v%2FrPdlidbOHWhPe3m%2BNgVqAUOQ7l0AjPUQB7mR7Q%3D&reserved=0 > > _______________________________________________ > > UNSUBSCRIBE: > > https://nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.evdl.org%2Fhelp%2Findex.html%23usub&data=02%7C01%7C%7C6536573ba83247a82f6e08d7ad6c0a38%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637168551850209477&sdata=fNpjS5gmcBOqETSWMD2XvtFhk6WbwbbvkdLS6pHhFZE%3D&reserved=0 > > ARCHIVE: > > https://nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.evdl.org%2Farchive%2Findex.html&data=02%7C01%7C%7C6536573ba83247a82f6e08d7ad6c0a38%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637168551850209477&sdata=PdPlFkaPk5f3UVgARfsMcvxzYMZSq27rix6Sc%2FCZ%2BZE%3D&reserved=0 > > INFO: > > https://nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Flists.evdl.org%2Flistinfo.cgi%2Fev-evdl.org&data=02%7C01%7C%7C6536573ba83247a82f6e08d7ad6c0a38%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637168551850209477&sdata=LoiLA5272qAmiO4ESdXQFCTQnaQQFgxCBq5jg2ZgvLw%3D&reserved=0 > > Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA > > (https://nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fgroups.yahoo.com%2Fgroup%2FNEDRA&data=02%7C01%7C%7C6536573ba83247a82f6e08d7ad6c0a38%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637168551850219485&sdata=vvOwKgR%2B2DfrXlmx8DzyoMQGX0QIAhTCgrHJPY90a40%3D&reserved=0) > > > > _______________________________________________ > UNSUBSCRIBE: > https://nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.evdl.org%2Fhelp%2Findex.html%23usub&data=02%7C01%7C%7C6536573ba83247a82f6e08d7ad6c0a38%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637168551850219485&sdata=RvYgXPb39J4NZRuwBfNdxVocAR3Hh8S0ztX3H6qyOF0%3D&reserved=0 > ARCHIVE: > https://nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.evdl.org%2Farchive%2Findex.html&data=02%7C01%7C%7C6536573ba83247a82f6e08d7ad6c0a38%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637168551850219485&sdata=bGGL%2Fic3c3D2RaRAywpINbs%2FDu0KIiT97AB2duSb48A%3D&reserved=0 > INFO: > https://nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Flists.evdl.org%2Flistinfo.cgi%2Fev-evdl.org&data=02%7C01%7C%7C6536573ba83247a82f6e08d7ad6c0a38%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637168551850219485&sdata=4dR3fX1Qj4hXQynNPllQ%2FKHSoEic6L%2FfiTNHYCMTX%2Fs%3D&reserved=0 > Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA > (https://nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fgroups.yahoo.com%2Fgroup%2FNEDRA&data=02%7C01%7C%7C6536573ba83247a82f6e08d7ad6c0a38%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637168551850219485&sdata=vvOwKgR%2B2DfrXlmx8DzyoMQGX0QIAhTCgrHJPY90a40%3D&reserved=0) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... 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