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On Aug 31, 4:19 am, Bruno Marchal <marc...@ulb.ac.be> wrote: > On 30 Aug 2009, at 10:12, marc.geddes wrote: > > > But look at this. I decide to do the following experience. I prepare > an electron so that it is in state up+down. I measure it in the base > {up, down}, and I decide to take holiday in the North if I find it up, > and to the south, if I find it down. > Not only that. I decide to go, after the holiday, to the amnesia > center where all my memories, from the state of the electron to > everything which follows, except my feeling about how much I enjoy the > holliday. And I am asked to answer by yes or no to the question "did > you enjoy your holiday. Then, thanks to the amnesia my yes+no states > will be used In this way. I interfere with myself, and what will > follow in the new branch where I have fuse with myself, my, and your, > future is determined by my contentment qualia, in the two branches of > the waves. This assumes that qualia are completely determined by the wave function, which (since Bohm is non-reductionist) I'm sure he'd dispute. The wave function only predicts physical states, it does not neccesserily completely determine higher-level properties such qualia (although of course qualia depends on low-level physics). If the wave function DID completely determine the qualia, your example would indeed contradict Bohm - but Bohm already admits he's non- reductionist. > In Everett universal wave (or Heisenberg universal matrix) and already > in arithmetic, "physicalness" is an indexical, we don't need the > notion of reality, just relative self-consistency. > We can cease to reify matter, and this is nice because I think that > this is what stuck us on the mind-body problem so long. > > > reality has two levels, so really there's > > two different definitions of 'real' in Bohm. > > You say so. > > > There are no 'people' in > > the wave, its a more abstrast entity than ordinary concrete reality. > > Ordinary concrete reality is a projection of the ordinary universal > machine from an infinity of them, to sum up roughly UDA conclusion. > > A deep weakness of Bohm, is that we can do all the possible uses of QM > from the SWE only, and then we have to solve a complex potential > equation to just "eliminate" the possibility of life and consciousness > in the parallel world? > And this by assuming weird things like non-locality (the root of Bohm > "non reductionism, I think), and non comp (or is this the root of "non > reductionism". A weakness of MWI is that it does not describe the reality we actually see - additional steps are needed to convert wave function to human observables - Bohm makes this clear, MWI just disguises it. Even in MWI, additional unexpected steps (Born probabilities derivation etc) are needed to convert wave function to what we actually observe. --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---