# Re: Information: a basic physical quantity or rather emergence/supervenience phenomenon

On 2/1/2012 3:10 PM, Evgenii Rudnyi wrote:
On 29.01.2012 22:49 Russell Standish said the following:
On Sun, Jan 29, 2012 at 04:23:12PM +0100, Evgenii Rudnyi wrote:
On 28.01.2012 23:26 meekerdb said the following:
On 1/27/2012 11:47 PM, Evgenii Rudnyi wrote:

A good suggestion. It well might be that I express my thoughts
unclear, sorry for that. Yet, I think that my examples show that

1) There is information
and entropy

that engineers employ.

Some engineers employ information, some the thermodynamic entropy. I have not seen though an engineering paper where both information and the thermodynamic entropy have been used as synonyms.

2) There is the thermodynamic entropy.

+ thermodynamic information

3) Numerical values in 1) and 2) are not related to each other.

Fixed that for you. Why should you expect the different types of
information that come from different contexts to have the same
numerical value? The whole point of "On complexity and emergence" is
that notions of information and entropy are complete context
sensitive (that is not to say their subjective as such - people
agreeing on the context will agree on the numerical values).

First the thermodynamic entropy is not context depended. This must mean that if it is the same as information, then the latter must not be context dependent as well. Could you please give me an example of a physical property that is context dependent?

Temperature is context dependent. If we consider physics at the level of atoms there is no such a quantity as temperature. Additionally, thermodynamic entropy does require Boltzmann's constant to be defined with is a form of context dependency as it specifies the level at which we are to take micro-states as macroscopically indistinguishable.

Onward!

Stephen

Second, when I have different numerical values, this could mean that the units are different. Yet, if this is not the case, then in my view we are talking about two different entities.

Could you please explain then what is common between 1) and 2)?

Evgenii

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