Hi Bruno Marchal 

I have heard testimony that during an NDE the person was
able to go up into the fan above the operating room and read the
name of the manf of the fan. That's pretty specific.

In another, a boy and his father were both involved in a 
near-fatal crash. The boy's head was actually separated 
(inside the flesh or skin) from his body. In his NDE he
saw his father being taken away in an ambulance and
reported back later the soccrect fact the one of the
paramedics had a certain color jacket on.

Also, you can't define a test protocol because you'd have to
put a person into a near death state.  

Youtube has oodles of acccounts of NDEs.  They can't all be false. 


----- Receiving the following content ----- 
From: Bruno Marchal 
Receiver: everything-list 
Time: 2013-01-21, 10:18:47
Subject: Re: Third person NDE




On 21 Jan 2013, at 02:41, spudboy...@aol.com wrote:


This may be totally irrelavent, but NDE studlier, Raymond Moody, has a book 
published about 3 years ago, called Glimpses of Eternity, in which NDE's and 
passings-on are a shared experience, including a life review, seen by family 
and friends.


I found this interesting, but still annoying by the lack of seriousness on some 
points. Notably that people having NDE can describe objects in their vicinity 
during the experiences. I am not against that notion, but they don't describe 
serious protocol to assess them and conclude too much hastily. Of course if 
comp is true, such discovery would make the comp substitution level much lower 
than most neuro-philosopher believes today. 










Supposedly, such family and friends, are not under the influence of 
psychotropic medications at the time, and what it has to do with Arithmatical 
Contradiction, I am sadly, ignorant. 




For the case of ideally correct machine, an arithmetical contradiction (which 
does not exist) is equivalent to death (which does not exist for such ideal 
machines). If you prefer: going near an arithmetical contradiction (like in the 
video(*)  where they did it by ignoring the metric system!) is equivalent with 
going near death.


Some psychotropic medication might lead a brain to a state similar to some near 
death state. This is a common assumption concerning some mushroom, tabernanthe 
iboga, salvia divinorum, high LSD dose, DMT, etc. Note that sleep is itself a 
way to experiment such "near death" altered conscious state.
The brain can plausibly have tricks to manage extreme (near death) situations. 
This has a survival value, especially for the mammals who fight a lot, like 
humans. 


What I found interesting in the video is that some survivor have a discourse 
quite close to the discourse done by patient after salvia or iboga, without an 
account of a first person NDE, and of course, without taking psychedelic (well, 
one was under alcohol, and he was not happy about that).





But I'd thought I would pass it this way to see if there was any connection,at 
all? 


Thanks for the question and comment. 


Bruno



-Mitch






(*) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ribT9NfkAsg






http://iridia.ulb.ac.be/~marchal/

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