On Wed, Feb 13, 2013 at 4:45 PM, Craig Weinberg <whatsons...@gmail.com> wrote:

>> What is to stop duplication of, say, the simplest possible conscious
>> being made up of only a few atoms?
> Because I suspect that conscious beings are not made of atoms, rather atoms
> exist in the experience of beings. Experiences cannot be duplicated
> literally, because I suspect that unique is the only thing that experiences
> can literally be.

That's what you suspect, but in order for you to be correct there must
be a mysterious non-physical entity that cannot be duplicated, even
with advanced scientific methods. This is equivalent to saying it is
magic. You get offended when I say this, perhaps because it has a
pejorative connotation, but that's what it is. Calling it something
else does not change the facts.

>> Sometimes the objection is raised
>> that an exact quantum state cannot be measured (although it can be
>> duplicated via quantum teleportation, with destruction of the
>> original), but this is probably spurious. If duplication down to the
>> quantum level were needed to maintain continuity of consciousness then
>> it would be impossible to maintain continuity of consciousness from
>> moment to moment in ordinary life, since the state of your body
>> changes in a relatively gross way and you remain you.
> Can the year 1965 be duplicated? If you wanted just one millisecond from
> 1965. What I am suggesting is that the entire assumption of the universe as
> bodies or particles be questioned. The universe is unique variations of a
> single experience, with a continuum of 'similarity' in between, contingent
> upon the experiential capacity of the participant.

There is no reason in principle why the year 1965 could not be
replicated. In fact, in several models of cosmology it *is*
duplicated. Even if there is only one universe but it is infinite in
extent, given a large enough volume there is bound to be an exact copy
of anything you care to name.

>> So what you have to explain Craig is what you think would happen if
>> you tried to duplicate a person using very advanced science,
> If you tried to duplicate a person's body, then you get an identical twin -
> my guess is probably a dead one.

If it's dead then you would have made some mistake in the duplication.
If you haven't made a mistake and it's still dead then there is magic
involved, which science will not be able to fathom no matter how

>> and why
>> you don't think that happens when a person lives his life from day to
>> day,
> Because the cells of the body exist within experiences, not the other way
> around. We aren't spirits or bodies, we are lifetimes.
>> having his brain replaced completely (and imprecisely) over the
>> course of months with the matter in the food he eats.
> It's like saying the cars on a freeway are replaced constantly so it is no
> longer a freeway. What makes the traffic is the participation of drivers who
> employ vehicles to take them places. Understanding the phenomenon as just a
> statistical pattern of positions and frequencies, or of objects in a spatial
> relation are both interesting and useful, but without the underlying
> sensory-motive grounding, it's ultimately meaningless to the big picture.

Cells and cell components are constantly being replaced yet you
survive. Therefore, it is possible to make a copy of you using
inanimate matter; for that is in fact what you are.

Stathis Papaioannou

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