On Thu, Mar 21, 2013 at 12:53 PM, Craig Weinberg <whatsons...@gmail.com> wrote:

>> How could something non-living lead to something living?
> Non-living and living are just different qualities of experience. Living
> systems are nested non-living systems, which gives rise to mortality and
> condenses an eternal perceptual frame into a more qualitatively saturated
> temporary perceptual frame.
>> How could
>> something non-computational could lead to something computational?
> Easily. You have a bunch of junk in your closet, so you organize it. That is
> what computation is. A system for organizing experience.

I'm not sure what you mean with your distinction between living and
non-living, but it seems that you can get living from living,
computational from non-computational and intentional from
non-intentional. If you want to say that the non-living,
non-computational and non-intentional already had a dormant form of
the quality they were lacking then you could say that but I don't see
what it adds.

>> Please show one piece of evidence demonstrating that a physical
>> process occurs in the brain that cannot be completely explained as
>> caused by another physical process. Note that it isn't good enough to
>> point to complex behaviour and say "in there somewhere".
> Laughing at a joke demonstrates that semantic content causes physical
> responses. Any activity in the brain which relates to anything in the world
> or the mind has nothing to do with neurochemistry. Physical processes can
> induce experiences, but only because experiences are a priori part of the
> cosmos. There is nothing about the physical processes which you recognize
> which could possibly relate laughter to a joke, or anger to an injustice,
> etc. There is no way for your physics of the brain to represent anything
> except the brain.

The claim is that the physics explains all of the physical activity. A
door does not open unless someone or something pushes it, whether it's
a person, a gust of wind, the reaction from a decaying  radioisotope
in the wood, or whatever. If the door is a little one inside the brain
that does NOT mean it opens without any identifiable physical cause.
If the little door opens in response to a joke it is because the
physical manifestations of the joke (sound waves) cause some other
physical process which makes it open. It does NOT open because the
joke just magically makes it open, which is what would appear to
happen if consciousness had a direct causal effect on matter.

Stathis Papaioannou

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