On 25 Jan 2014, at 21:24, Platonist Guitar Cowboy wrote:
On Sat, Jan 25, 2014 at 8:00 PM, John Clark <[email protected]>
wrote:
On Sat, Jan 25, 2014 at 4:41 AM, Bruno Marchal <[email protected]>
wrote:
> You attack the straw man, again.
Billions of people believe in this "straw man" , and that is exactly
why using the word "God" is totally irresponsible if you're not
talking about a intelligent conscious being who created the universe.
> This was not the definition of "god" that I gave.
For you "God" need not be intelligent nor conscious nor even be a
being, and that means you've twisted the word complete out of shape,
presumably because you feel that your mouth makes a plesent sound
when it says "God".
>> So being intelligent or even conscious is no longer an essential
ingredient that "God" must have,
> Open problem.
No it is not, for virtually everybody being intelligent and
conscious are more important attributes than even omnipotence that
something must have to be called God. To use the word "God" for
something mindless is ridiculous.
>>> It has no name.
>> Which hasn't prevented you from giving it a name G-O-D!
> See Plotinus
No thanks, Greek philosophers were ignoramuses.
> Well. Comp answers this question clearly and unambiguously.
Well good for "comp".
> dawkins believe in the Aristotelian God "Nature", or "Physical
universe".
The above sentence is absolutely true, provided of course that words
can mean whatever you choose them to mean.
> the UDA shows that comp is incompatible with such notion of God.
I've looked but I don't see where it's mentioned, see if you can
find it:
http://uda.varsity.com/
> You talk like a priest who is shocked because some dare to doubt
your "God", or conception of reality.
Wow, calling a guy known for disliking religion religious, never
heard that one before, at least I never heard it before I was 12.
Lol, you are JC on the ledge/pulpit of this list proclaiming
fanatically, every week for years this same sermon.
Content and style of which is always something like:
I DISLIKE AND HAVE NOTHING BUT SCORN FOR ALL RELIGIONS AND FOLLOW
NONE IF NOT PEER REVIEWED!
I GREW UP WHEN I WAS 12! (Why twelve, and compliments to your memory
btw? Is 12 some kind of stupidity threshold? Dumb at 11 and come
12th birthday, a light bulb is switched on upstairs? Is 12 the age
when Einstein...never mind)
GREEK PHILOSOPHERS ARE IGNORAMUSES!
Your surprise "Wow, geez, calling a guy a religious when they
dislike religion is sooo shocking..." is as sincere as it's always
been. If one were a jerk, one might actually believe it.
From an article by Niccolo Tucci on Einstein in The New Yorker (Nov
22, 1947).
“The more I read the Greeks, the more I realize that nothing like
them has ever appeared in the world since.”
“You read the Greeks?” I said.
“But of course,” he replied, slightly surprised at my amazement. And
so I heard, partly from him and partly from Miss Dukas, that he
reads the Greeks to Maja every night for an hour or so, even if he
has had a very tiring day. Empedocles, Sophocles, Aeschylus, and
Thucydides receive the tribute of the most advanced and abstract
modern science every night, in the calm voice of this affectionate
brother who keeps his sister company.
“You know,” I said, “that is great news. Young Americans, who have
an idea of the pure scientist worthy of the comics, should be told
that Einstein reads the Greeks. All those who relish the idiotic and
dangerous myth of the scientist as a kind of Superman, free from all
bonds of responsibility, should know this and draw their conclusions
from it. Many people in our day go back to the Greeks out of sheer
despair. So you too, Herr Professor, have gone back to the Greeks.”
He seemed a little hurt. “But I have never gone away from them,” he
said. “How can an educated person stay away from the Greeks? I have
always been far more interested in them than in science.”
Hmmmkay? Good. PGC
Nice quote. John should read the book by Jammer on Einstein's
religion. 2/3 of that book is really informative about Einstein's
religion.
John seems to be unaware what God was for the greeks, and for most
genuinely religious mystical persons. John acts in a way which is
typical for the usual christians. They fear anything which can
generate a doubt on their dogma.
My father lost faith in the Christian religion the day he got a course
on greek art, in a catholic institution, when the teacher censored
anything sexual from the pictures (that is almost everything!). He
thought that those who needs to hide things cannot be genuine
believer. As a reaction he became atheists, but it was more
anticlericalism, and on the deep truth he will eventually become
agnostic.
Bruno
John K Clark
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