On Tue, Jun 24, 2014 at 2:28 PM, Platonist Guitar Cowboy < [email protected]> wrote:
> > > > On Tue, Jun 24, 2014 at 1:35 PM, Telmo Menezes <[email protected]> > wrote: > >> I have to say, I find it a bit silly when people identify too much with >> their nationality (or profession, or gender...) to the point that they get >> offended when a generic remark is made. >> >> It is fairly obvious that Kim is not suggesting that Chris or Brent or >> any other specific American in this list is a person of low intelligence. >> The generalisation per se might be without merit, but even so it's perhaps >> a good exercise in to learn to tolerate it. >> >> We have more in common with each other than with the average citizen of >> any of our respective countries. >> Why care so much about imaginary lines in the ground? >> > > Because without it, opium for the masses like FIFA world cup makes less > sense, and people would start to realize and have more time to ponder that > they are getting shafted... and by whom. > Yup. > Also we need to get rid of those immigrants stealing all our jobs and vote > hard right. At least that's what civilized Europe is doing increasingly. > I want to believe that this is a passing fad of populism festering on the economic recession. > So you're saying this, but really, you are lamenting Portugal's > performance ;-) PGC > Eheh. Hey, Ronaldo had the best haircut though :) I can't resist sharing what my favourite comedian (American, btw) has to say about nationalism and hating immigrants: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QsPDT5qHtZ4 Cheers Telmo. > > >> >> Cheers, >> Telmo. >> >> >> >> On Tue, Jun 24, 2014 at 12:58 PM, Kim Jones <[email protected]> >> wrote: >> >>> Of course my founding post to this thread was "racist". It was a clear >>> attempt to label a box and to shove all Americans in there. Not very smart, >>> you suppose. Not if I myself were unconscious of the inherent racism of >>> what I said. But I was fully conscious of it. Is that still racism? It's >>> not that I am a racist, but I definitely felt there to be a point in saying >>> something that might strike others as racist because this is a good way to >>> put people on their toes. It was done for a purpose to do with creative >>> thinking. That purpose is an operation known as "provocation". I am >>> provoking others to respond, in order to see the thinking. In fact I am not >>> racist at all because I admire Americans greatly. How could one not. But I >>> wrote something racist in order to see whether some others might see that >>> they were being provoked. Provocation is sometimes necessary in order that >>> people see things they feel they know very well in a new light. Creative >>> thinking is taking existing information and extracting new value from it. >>> >>> For example, had I said the following: >>> >>> "America is the land of the free. America champions the cause of freedom >>> the world over and will fight fiercely to maintain a free world. Americans >>> are all natural-born entrepreneurs and understand business in an intuitive >>> way better than anyone else on the planet. Anyone can succeed with a new >>> idea in America because Americans love a new idea and will get behind it >>> and help it to come to fruition, particularly if that idea helps support >>> the cause of freedom and successful entrepreneurial business enterprises." >>> >>> - would I still be guilty of racism? The mental operation is identical; >>> I have a box and I am shoving an entire country into it. The point should >>> be clear: what motivates all thinking are the values espoused by the >>> thinker, and those values are based on their 1p experiences. >>> >>> That's what perception is. Perception is "first order thinking" which is >>> to say more a statement about ourselves, not at all the thing we would like >>> others to believe we are talking about. The very first thing we experience >>> in any exchange or encounter with the "outside world" is not the outside >>> world at all, but ourselves. We meet ourselves in everything we say and do. >>> >>> To continue with perception for a moment: I said above that Americans >>> love freedom, America is the land of the free etc. All this is true. But it >>> is true in only a limited sense. It is true in the sense that choices are >>> able to be made without coercion or force being applied. For example, an >>> man sits at a table in a restaraunt in France and is presented with a >>> choice of beverages. There is wine, there is cognac, there is cider, there >>> is champagne and there is Budweiser beer. The man freely chooses the beer. >>> A free choice is made. But the choice is made not out of curiosity but out >>> of familiarity. Is that still freedom of choice? If you are ignorant of the >>> qualities of the various alternatives to your preferred choice, in what >>> sense are you making a free choice? More likely you are shackled to your >>> preference. >>> >>> When we do creative thinking, we learn to take familiar situations and >>> traverse a different path in thinking about them. This requires training >>> and is not at all a natural habit of mind. >>> >>> Kim >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "Everything List" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>> an email to [email protected]. >>> To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. >>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. >>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>> >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Everything List" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to [email protected]. >> To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. >> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >> > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. 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