On 8/16/2014 10:19 PM, LizR wrote:
On 17 August 2014 07:14, meekerdb <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>>
wrote:
Both consciousness and physics supervene on the computations, which
exist necessarily. Consciousness does not supervene on the physics.
Yes, I agreed to that. The question was can consciousness supervene on
computations
that do not instantiate any physics? I think not.
Would you mind clarifying this? I'm not what it means that consciousness can only
supervene on computations that instantiate physics. For example - assuming my brain is
doing computations, how is it instantiating physics? Or did you mean that the brain is a
physical object, and hence instantiated within physics, so to speak?
No I mean you need something to think about that has the consistency and stabiltiy of an
external world. You need to be able to think in terms of objects, bodies, motions,
numbers, perceptions,... Of course language gives you this, but you have some of it prior
to language which I think is "hardwired" by evolution.
And then the other question is can physics supervene on computations that
do not
instantiate any consciousness? I'm not sure about that.
If I read this arright, which I probably don't, this would be equivalent to comp
generating universes with no observers, which I imagine is by definition impossible.
Yes, that's what it would mean. But if comp can't generate universes with no observers
what does it mean that there were no people (or even jumping spiders) for most of the
duration of the universe? And what about distant parts of the universe that we can't
observe? And do we have to actually *be* observing for them to exist? Do we suppose that
they don't exist or do we take or theories of cosmology that indicate they should exist as
proof that there are observers of them?
Brent
But maybe the answer to the previous question will clarify this one.
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