On 12/2/2014 7:38 PM, LizR wrote:
On 3 December 2014 at 16:29, <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>>
wrote:
On Monday, December 1, 2014 1:45:57 AM UTC, Liz R wrote:
For some reason a lot of religious people attempt to argue that Darwin
was
wrong, just as a lot of people seem to have always wanted to show that
Einstein
was wrong. There appears to be something about these targets that
attracts a
certain type of person, even though there might be better pickings to
be had
objecting to the big bang or quantum theory from the point of view of
scoring
points for the worldview being pushed. After all, the Bible (for
example) says
that God made the Heavens and the Earth (and the rest of the universe
gets a
throwaway line), so why object specifically to evolution rather than,
say,
theories of planetary formation?
I'd guess because...
1. people take it personally that their ancestors were simpler
creatures.
2. it's a target they can sort of, more or less, understand, even if
they can't
really.
(I have a feeling people object to Einstein's theories because they
don't like
the idea of being browbeaten by Jewish intellectuals...)
I can't disagree for the simple reason creationist nut over-representation
on
Darwin and anti-Semite over representation on Einstein is fait accompli
pretty much
the same regardess which one of us is right. If you are right, then
....well you say
they are over-represented, and this is the case you are right, so...there
they are!
On the other hand if I'm right and these are two areas that have seen
periods of
large discouragement and disincentive to 'look there'. Well then, by
consequence of
that, all the genuine truth seekers never showed up at all. And the
consequence of
that is that the people that did show up are going to be religious nut and
anti-Semite over-represented.
So we have to go to the details Liz, and bring in other exhibits supporting
our case.
My Exhibit A is: Richard Feynman hasn't received anti-semitically motivated
criticism at anything like the levels you imply for Einstein. Yet for a
large number
of people he's up there at the very top table of great scientific genius.
He has
also received a huge amount of dissent and criticism. No one says that is
anti-Semitic. And by and large (I think) it's been dispelled.
See point 2. Theories have to be more or less understandable before the cranks start
attacking them. So "we evolved from apes" and "you can't travel faster than light" are
far easier targets than summing over histories and absorber theory and so on.
Right. And also it's easier to attack a theory developed by a single person by ad hominem
assertions. Einstein and Darwin developed their theories almost singel handedly, while
Feynman's contributions to QED were mainly calculational. The same concepts of QED were
shared with Schwinger and others.
Exhibit B is hugely disproportionate 25% of Nobels. A lot of big names
there and all
have received criticism yet none apparent involving dramatical levels of
anti-Semitism.
Exhibit C:
It's not about the theories with Einstein. It's about whether he took other
peoples
ideas. You are aware Hilbert published the complete field equations 5 days
before
Einstein?
That's ridiculous. Hilbert arrived at the same equations and he could have argued for
priority - although in fact he conceded to Einstein. But there's no way that Einstein
could have stolen Hilbert's idea and published in five days.
You are aware every single character of the 1905 paper bar one, appears in
papers in
1904, 1903 and further back.
Not only that I notice that all the characters in you post have previously been posted by
me. STOP THIS PLAGARISM!
Einstein claimed he never read them. Late in life he tacitly conceded he
did. And
his two close friends later went on record they all been there and they
pored over
those papers for weeks.
Those are legitimate reasons to doubt Einstein.
Those are not the sort of reasons people wheel out when they attack relativity
(generally special) or evolution. They claim to have spotted a flaw everyone else
missed, approaching it from a very pop-sci viewpoint.
Right. Cranks and wackos don't write papers defending Hilbert's priority to exactly the
same theory.
Brent
--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
"Everything List" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email
to [email protected].
To post to this group, send email to [email protected].
Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
