On Friday, May 17, 2019 at 1:51:15 PM UTC-5, Brent wrote: > > > > On 5/16/2019 11:59 PM, Philip Thrift wrote: > > > > On Friday, May 17, 2019 at 1:42:41 AM UTC-5, telmo wrote: >> >> >> >> But then "panpyschism" does no work. It's just a hypothetical property >> of matter that says if some matter does information processing then that >> matter is conscious, otherwise it's not. But that's already what >> materialists thought. >> >> >> Well said. >> >> Telmo. >> > > But a robot - which is matter - that is doing very advanced, high-level > information processing - could be a winner on Jeopardy, and talk to you in > a conversation, could be a zombie. > > Are you a zombie? > > > Not if human-level intelligent behavior is a mark of consciousness. How > do you tell if someone is conscious? > > Brent >
There is the paper I posted here earlier. Here's the conclusion. Do you have something better? *Information and the Origin of Qualia* Roger Orpwood Centre for Pain Research, Department for Health, University of Bath ... Despite the overwhelming likelihood that all higher animals experience a degree of consciousness, the only animals we can be a 100% certain about are humans. Therefore it is necessary ultimately to measure activity in humans that underpins conscious experience. For the theory presented here that evidence has to come from monitoring the activity of networks of individual cells, with sub-millisecond resolution, to see how they behave during conscious acts and how that differs to unconscious acts. Such work would necessarily have to remove co-varying activity relating to such things as allocation of attention, activity relating to the reporting process, anticipation, etc. Techniques for population monitoring are of course developing fast, with the pioneering use of 2-photon calcium imaging. At present this technique is not quite fast enough to explore the detail firing activity of cells in networks but this is surely not far off. In the first instance such techniques can be usefully used with higher mammals who are strongly suspected of having conscious experience. Strong pointers would result from monitoring local activity such as that described in this article as the animal indicated a perception as opposed to not indicating a perception. If in parallel with such measurements a signature of that activity could be defined using EEG, MEG or ECoG that would enable human experiments to look for those signatures. Ultimately though it will be necessary to find a technique that can be used in humans, perhaps an ethically acceptable form of light imaging, that can detect the local activity described and to show that it occurs only with conscious awareness. @philipthrift -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/a1bfd406-28ae-4cbb-8e2e-061a4f6bc01f%40googlegroups.com.
