On Fri, Jan 24, 2020 at 5:50 PM 'Brent Meeker' Everything List < [email protected]> wrote:
>> I would say a infinite amount of information would be needed to >> adequately > > > > *Nobody asked about the amount of information. * > Well you certainly didn't ask about it, you ignored information entirely and I would say that was the fundamental reason your analysis failed. > * > That's a red herring that LC threw in. * > A red herring?! Lawrence is wise enough to know that if you're developing a cosmological model while pretending information does not exist then you're heading for trouble. *> The question was about the expansion and size of the universe.* > No, the question was if the universe was infinite or finite. Yes if the position space (aka plain ordinary space) is infinite then it would be safe to say the universe is infinite, but that's just one attribute the universe can have, there is also momentum space and informational content; if either of those was infinite I would say that regardless of whether position space was infinite or not it would be misleading at best and dead wrong at worse to say the universe was finite. > * > As in my analogy, in a finite universe there are a finite number of > intervals of finite distance that can link any two points in the universe. > Of course this refers to it being finite at a given time, and you raised > the problem of defining what counts as "at the same time". The answer is > that it is at the same time if it is at the same degree of > expansion...operationally it means that two distant events are "at the same > time" if the isotropic temperature of the CMB looks the same to them.* > Even if we ignore Quantum Mechanics any finite level of precision used to measure the current position and momentum of those two particles or of the temperature of the CMB will soon (very soon because the universe is accelerating) prove to be insufficiently precise to predict their future position and momentum because phase space keeps getting larger at an accelerating rate. The fundamental reason you can't make a good prediction is you don't have enough information, an infinite amount is required and you don't have that. John K Clark -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/CAJPayv1O1gG6AAVYvJjUobLVHzpk%3DJx5Q3TCSRT5ersKbR9ucA%40mail.gmail.com.
