On Monday, January 6, 2025 at 2:37:39 PM UTC-7 Quentin Anciaux wrote: A troll feels absolutely no shame.
Quentin; I really don't want to get into a pissing contest with you. I suggest that you do us all a great service, including yourself, and respond to my substantive comments. If you do that, and your argument is persuasive, I will easily concede the argument. AG Le lun. 6 janv. 2025, 22:25, Alan Grayson <[email protected]> a écrit : On Monday, January 6, 2025 at 11:46:52 AM UTC-7 Alan Grayson wrote: On Monday, January 6, 2025 at 3:11:47 AM UTC-7 Alan Grayson wrote: On Sunday, January 5, 2025 at 10:02:28 PM UTC-7 Alan Grayson wrote: On Sunday, January 5, 2025 at 9:43:47 PM UTC-7 Brent Meeker wrote: On 1/5/2025 7:44 PM, Alan Grayson wrote: > You claim there is no objective fact. The car fitted in the garage. > But that's only from the garage frame. If it's from only one frame and not another, that's the definition of "not objective". It's not fact. It's subjective perception. Brent You truncated my statement. You showed the car fits in one frame and not the other (the car frame). The paradox is based on the belief that this is impossible. Disproving this belief is required to resolve the paradox. AG *Here is something to consider to prove what I believe needs to be proven;* *that the two frames under consideration are not in relative motion as the* *case of two inertial frames in empty space where nothing exists other than* *these two frames. In the paradox the car is in real detectable motion if one* *views its background, whereas the garage is fixed by the same observation.* *In fact, the garage and its surroundings can be considered a rigid body from* *the pov of the car frame, entirely in motion, not just the garage. I do not say* *t**his will work in possibly eliminating the relative motion of garage from * *the pov of the car frame and thus resolving the paradox, but it's a possibility* *worth **considering. AG * *Maybe you can explain this: we started with an apparent paradox based on length* *contraction. Then, to allegedly resolve it, several MB members including yourself, * *applied both length contraction and disagreement about simultaneity to get the* *SAME result which was patently obvious with nothing more than length contraction.* *At which point victory was declared; the alleged paradox was resolved! Praise the* *Lord! Can you tell me what I'm missing? And please; don't tell me that adding doors* *on the garage was needed or necessary. Without those doors it was obvious that* *the frames would disagree about whether the car would fit at some high speed. * *Maybe Jesse and Quentin could explain this as well. TY, AG* *I'd also like to hear from Clark on this issue. He was another great advocate of putting* *doors on the garage and thinking the problem was solved. As I see it, all that's been * *accomplished is to put some numbers on the problem, to calculate how good the fit* *is or isn't, without touching on the underlying problem. As for falsifying relativity, that's* *definitely not my preference. It seems to have worked for more than a century, so it's* *highly likely to be correct. But when all the experts here give their opinions, ISTM that * *none **are in the ballpark of actually shedding light on this problem. Of course, we can* *always adopt the "shut up and calculate" pov and conclude that that's what SR says, and * *be done with it. So, Clark, what do you think? AG * > It doesn't fit from the car frame, regardless of the doors, which IMO > can be dispensed with. So, as I see it, the paradox follows from the > belief that there can't be disagreement about what the frames > conclude. Isn't this the claim that must be disproven to resolve the > paradox, and a constructive proof that the frames disagree using the > LT is insufficient? AG -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/78eb2d55-4267-4695-96bf-3bd0f55740fbn%40googlegroups.com.
