On Fri, 2003-09-12 at 12:42, Charlie M. wrote: > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA1 > > September 12, 2003 12:51 pm, James Sparenberg wrote: > > > > Mr. Rankin; > > > > > > I do believe you're making a fairly broad assumption there David, > > > on little or no evidence. In fact I openly stated that I don't care > > > what they do to *survive,* as long as it doesn't become intrusive. > > > If that happens I won't wait to say goodbye; I'll be history and > > > thanks for the memories. So I would appreciate enormously you not > > > trying to speak for "100%" of Mandrake users. OK? > > > > > > You don't know what 100% of Mandrake users are thinking. If you > > > claim to you must have political aspirations, or are possibly > > > considering a career in the clergy, since to the best of my > > > knowledge they are the only individuals that make such sweeping > > > statements and broad assumptions just to get their faces "Out > > > There." > > > > > > On "Faith" in other words. So please try not to claim any form of > > > "poetic license" since that's just a polite word for bullshit. > > > > > > I've also seen posts from some others that lead me to believe that > > > they too would wait to see what happens. If we're running a > > > distribution of GNU/Linux, and we are; and if we're advocating > > > GNU/Linux to friends, family, and business associates, and it seems > > > we all are, then why the Hell are we complaining if a survival > > > mechanism for the distribution we all seem to treasure is > > > instituted so that we can keep working with it and the company > > > responsible for it? > > > > > > If none of us gave a shit we wouldn't be complaining so > > > vociferously, now would we? > > > > > > My own personal mantra doesn't include whining about the way the > > > world is. I'd rather devote my energies to making certain my own > > > little corner of the real world improves. For everyone. > > > > > > For the people that are willing to listen to me around these parts, > > > that improvement includes, and will continue to include for the > > > foreseeable future, Mandrake Linux. If the management of > > > MandrakeSoft have to take "drastic steps" to insure their corporate > > > survival it must mean they want that as well. > > > > > > I'll say it once more for those that didn't get it yet; > > > > > > As long as whatever the 'Powers That Be' in MandrakeSoft Management > > > do doesn't intrude on me, or those that I advocate the distribution > > > to, I'll back them the way I always have. If it does, _boom!_ I'm > > > gone. Not an ultimatum, a fact. A very *personal fact;* that means > > > nothing in the greater scheme of things. > > > > > > Clear enough? > > > > Actually, You must also consider that you are making a contextual > > assumption. That assumption is that what you believe him to be > > talking about is in fact what he's referring to. His statement is, > > accurate. Now as to what it is that 100% of it's users loath. He > > hasn't specified. You have assumed. He didn't specify. So > > personally I didn't feel he was making any statement with which I > > find fault. He's right ... if 100% (or statistically close to 100% > > since nothing of man, is ever absolute.) of the users loath it. It > > will kill it. If however it isn't something that 100% loath but a > > large enough group do loath it also will kill, or cripple it. (Case > > in point, the Edsel, one vehicle line out of 20 offered that year, > > that nearly bankrupted Ford.) > > Bullshit James. 100% is 100% all the time every time and I don't fit the > profile.
So then 100% isn't 100% it's 99.999999999 (infinity) > So I'm making no assumptions here. I'm stating unequivocally > the simple fact that nobody but me has the right to speak for me. In > any way. Mathematically yes. You are correct. But in real life it's often not. Humans being what they are. Ask G-Dubya. > > In other words that "IF" (yours) is an awfully big word and I want to > know what "If" means. ;) And I'm searching but can't find the word if except where you use it...... hmmmm. > > DR> > "Good bye Mandrake........ > > I can think of no more assinine way to kill a distribution's > reputation > than to add to it what 100% of its user loath." > > under the subject line: > > DR> > "Re: [expert] (OT)Mandrake and Advertising." > borrowed from you BTW. > > Still no assumption except for David's that he knows what "100% of it's > users loath." What is "it's?" Nobody here has been talking to me about > what I think. Nor has anyone endeavoured to read my mind. And if I did read your mind what makes you think I'd let you know *grin*. > > > You yourself, have given over a scenario that might qualify as part > > of the 100% loath factor. When the adds intrude upon what you want > > to do. Say for example ... data mining. Personally I put the adds in > > place of screensavers (look into cooker you'll see that 9.2 has no > > screensavers other than xscreensaver in the main. This means that > > the adds are for Gnome and KDE the only available screensaver.) On > > the order of zeroconf, galaxy and mdkkdm. Unwanted intrusions that > > fall under the first order of removal and only serve to make Mandrake > > installs look more complicated than they really are. > > Ah yes, I'll concede that point. To a degree, because the assumption > *you* are making is that I would "loath" some undefined thing. All I > said is that I would choose not to tolerate that behaviour, not that my > fondness would turn to loathing. The difference is that I'm "assuming" > that the choice is mine and that nobody has decided for me. No I didn't really assume you per se would loath it. I said that it is a scenario that might qualify. > > Like any other entity in Nature; MandrakeSoft has to evolve to survive. > Evolution apparently makes mistakes. Whoops, bye-bye most of the > creatures that left fossil records in the Burgess Shale. You were a > thriving ecosystem in your time, but ultimately were losers. My point has not been to argue against. In fact ... I know where to get the needed source to "fix" things. (Hey I've got a RH 9 box that runs KDE not Blue!) My point was that it's neither the time nor place to get hostile or accusatory. Rather instead I'm hoping that getting the attitudes aired now will create a more productive environ later. Like when hundreds of users flood the newbie and expert group asking about "adware" and wondering if data mining is happening (it is adware and no, I don't suspect data mining. But to the millions of windowed wanders out there, ads == data mining.) > > I don't want MandrakeSoft the company and Mandrake Linux the > distribution to go the way of other evolutionary dead ends. That's up > to them. > 1.)Adapt, change and survive. Or; > 2.) don't adapt and die, adapt, change and still die from not paying > attention to your advocates and supporters. > 3.) Or adapt, try, change, listen and thrive. Nor do I. But just because it makes money doesn't make it right. (TV preachers and Scientology come to mind here but I didn't say that.) Nor does it make it the right thing to do. Personally, I think the concept of selling copies would be viable. (It isn't the easiest thing to do by far, buy a copy that is, doable..... but not easy.) > > Which is my preference? I'll let you guess. <g> > > Advertising this way may have a total "Burgess Shale Effect" but it's > the right of the management to decide what direction to steer the > company, and the distribution. Not mine. If they have done any studies > they'll know by previously determined patterns; and from empirical > observable behavioural evidence, that creatures such as myself will > banish them from our thought patterns if they piss us off. Again, not > an assumption, speaking for myself. "...creatures such as myself..." My observations have been that if you make the changes a little at a time... rarely does anyone complain. Until it's too late. Let's see, first there was the Sonny Bono(bonehead) act to take Mickey Mouse out of the public domain, then the Berne (sp) treaty was used to create the DMCA, and by that time .... nearly to late. > > > > James > > Thanks for the debate James. This is fun. :-) > > Maybe I should get back to work? >
Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
