--- In [email protected], akasha_108 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > Thata a fine "rap" as unc would say. But it has little to do with the > question I posed in the original post (at end). Not to say that you > need to address my points -- you are free to go off on your own > thoughts and tangents. But you certainly did not address the central > point of my post, if thats what you intended to do. > > I am not against giving up expectations in many contexts. I am asking > what remains of a desire if there is no expectation. Perhaps reread > what I wrote in the original post below. A desire seems tied to some > thought of an outcome. If there is no thought of outcome, there is no > desire, there is only an impulse towards action. > > If there is no expectation, it implies all outcomes are random. If so, > then what is the role of desire? If I "desire" to watch a DVD movie, > but if the action of opening the refrigerator, taking a nap or turning > on the DVD player all have the equal random probability of producing a > movie, then the link between desire and outcome is so weak, I hold one > would lose "desire". If I have no credible and repeatable way to "play > a movie", then why desire it. Its like a desire to be a trillionaire. > I have no credible way of becoming one, so the desire is not really > there. I have no credible way of dating Heather Graham, so I don't > really desire it. I have no credible way of becoming President of the > United States, at this point in my life, so I don't really desire it. > > Beyond this theme, is another "absurdity" in the idea of "giving up > expectations" It can can go to abusrd levels if taken to all contexts. > If all actions and outcomes are just random, for example, if you walk > towards a wall, do you hold thre is an equal probability that you will > walk through it as being "bumped" by it? > > The very basis of rational thought, inquiry, scientific method and > understanding of nature is the systematic study of what outcomes occur > when particular actions are take. And the EXPECTATION that the > outcomes will repeat themselves when the action is repeated. > > For example, when you turn on the light switch, do you not have an > expectation of light? I have this image, not of you, but the image > becomes comic, seeing a new-age, daffy type girl (Lisa Kudrow's > character Phoebe on "Friends" perhaps) turning on the lightswitch and > going, "well, what ever happens is total kewl. I don't really expect > the light to go on, or to stay off. I am just playing with the switch, > clicking it, another random act with any number of possible random > outcomes. la de da. The universe will do what the universe will do." > (well maybe thats a bit to involved for phoebe.) > > > So my thoughts are: > > 1) Giving up expectations for "uncontrollable" actions/outcomes is a > good thing. > > 2) When expectations are given up for actions that have uncontrollable > outcomes, then the ensuing link to desire is weakened and desire > shivels to an impotent form, or dissappears altogether. > > 3) The process of identifying the link between actions and outcomes, > and EXPECTING these "found" "dis" "covered" links to be repeateable, > and having an expectation they will repeatly occur when the causal > action is taken, is a good thing, and the basis of science and > technology. > > What are your thoughts on such? > ***** Yes it was a fast written rap. And it is true that I didn't read properly with thought your post. You have right in that expectation is OK in well established patterns. E.g. when I open the refrigerator I expect or even know that there is food. When I communicate with a person I expect certain kind of behaviour based on past experience. When I behave myself in a certain way I expect similar outcomes I have earlier had. In these simple cases I can recognize clear expectation of outcome. There are also a lot of activities where the outcome is not so certain and in those situations the expectation is much looser. There I'm prepared to many outcomes and maybe my mind approximates some probabilities for different outcomes. However desire and expectation clearly have quite different energetic flavour for me. Desire is a deeper and more powerful thing. A desire puts my attention and intention on certain directions where to work or transform energies. At depth there is certainly behind the desire a hope for outcomes in a broad category, but the focus is in the work. And there I an have expectations connected to the steps I take in the work and if they are not met, small adjustments to the path are made. There are all the time present this kind of monitoring. If I do a certain kind of physical exercise and I don't feel fully good about it afterwards, I make adjustments to the regime. The same applies to the inner transformative work I do. I make experiments and then adjustments based on the results all the time. It could be said that adjustments are made because I feel something is missing and I perceive avenues where this missing part could be better included. Long ago I participated in a seminar, where we were put to work with our unfullfilled dreams and desires. First we had to list them. Other participants could easily produce a long list. I couldn't. And even more difficulties I had in figuring out concrete one year or five year plans to achieve them. It doesn't work like that for me. The means is just in the moment.And a lot of the path is just automatically emerging and this emerging doesn't obey expectations and commands and will power, but seems to obey deep desires. Irmeli To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
