The title is the worse part of the book. Did you read it? The point of the book isn't actually his NDE.
>________________________________ > From: curtisdeltablues <[email protected]> >To: [email protected] >Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2013 7:35 AM >Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Michael Shermer rebuts Eben Alexander > > > >Hi Emily, > >Hi five for bringing new material. I grabbed it at the library as soon as its >catnip (for me) title had its effect. I had to read some of the critiques to >understand the scientific issues with his claims. > >Evaluating this book is a great education in how we need to approach the flood >of popular books from scientists or doctors without a background in the field. >Scientific understanding is a collaborative process filled with outliers >expanding the edges of the known as well as people who are just a bit off. It >taught me a lot about how complex determining death is in the short run. In >the long run it becomes more obvious! > >Neurosurgeons are as naive as anyone else concerning the issues with being >confident of our knowledge if they have not studied epistemology. He makes a >few fatal errors in his assumptions. > >Having had the kind of experiences he recounts in the altered states produced >by lots of meditation, I understand the compelling nature of what the brain >can produce. I suspect under the extreme conditions his was under are even >more compelling. > >His title is fascinating: Proof of Heaven: A Neurosurgeon's Journey into the >Afterlife. It makes us feel as if we should take his claim more seriously >because of his background doesn't it? It worked on me. But in the end we >have a subjective account with no scientific way to know when exactly he had >these experiences as his brain powered down and up. So we are left with >another account that uses the tantalizing concept of "near" death which sounds >more like death than "not" death in the same way that "barely" legal porn gets >more Internet porn hits than "legal" porn. (Or so I am told having no first >hand knowledge in this area.) > >Our minds are amazing and the collaborative effect of minds trying to get to >the bottom of life's deepest questions is fascinating. I will always respond >to the catnip of the outliers, but wont be surprised when, after more study, >they don't quite deliver what they promised. I always learn from taking the >ride. > >--- In [email protected], Emily Reyn <emilymae.reyn@...> wrote: >> >> Read the book Xeno and then I would love to have a discussion with >> you.....it was written by a neuroscientist after all.  And he addresses >> exactly what you discuss below in the context of medical science.  >> >> >> >> >________________________________ >> > From: Xenophaneros Anartaxius <anartaxius@...> >> >To: [email protected] >> >Sent: Monday, March 25, 2013 8:22 PM >> >Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Michael Shermer rebuts Eben Alexander >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> >--- In [email protected], Emily Reyn <emilymae.reyn@> wrote: >> >> >> >> This is a beautiful picture.  Can you believe I just finished this >> >> book?  Eben Alexander refutes all this in the later Chapters of this >> >> book - he addresses this supposition of hallucination specifically by >> >> making the very real point that his neocortex was not functioning, >> >> amongst other things.  >> >> >> >How would he, in that state, know whether he even had a neocortex? Someone >> >had to feed him this information. Neurologists point out that even in >> >states where the patient seems to be in cardiac arrest, there is some >> >slight activity that keeps a small amount of blood flow to the brain. In >> >these emergency situations, there is no electroencephalographic monitoring >> >of the brain, though that might be introduced as additional controls >> >someday. No one has figured out just when a patient has the NDE in these >> >situations as they cannot point out they are having an experience, so >> >currently there are a lot of unknowns about these experiences. Those that >> >believe in NDEs assume the brain is not functioning, but this is unknown >> >except in the case where the patient does not revive, and then of course >> >they do not report an NDE. These kinds of experiences often occur under >> >very specific circumstances where a patient or a subject is not in a life >> >threatening situation such >> as cardiac arrest, which is why scientists very substantially question >> whether they have any 'supernatural' component at all. >> >> >> >> >________________________________ >> >> > From: Yifu <yifuxero@> >> >> >To: [email protected] >> >> >Sent: Monday, March 25, 2013 7:04 PM >> >> >Subject: [FairfieldLife] Michael Shermer rebuts Eben Alexander >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> >"Allegory of the Resurrection of Jesus Christ" by Pat Devonas: >> >> >http://www.museumsyndicate.com/images/2/10741.jpg >> >> > >> >> >Dr. Michael Shermer attempts to rebut Dr. Eben Alexander's NDE as being >> >> >genuinely "out of body" and supernatural. (Alexander is a neurosurgeon >> >> >who had an NDE. Claims he traveled out of the body into supernatural >> >> >dimensions in which he met deceased relatives, and listened to the OM.) >> >> >... >> >> >Shermer in Scientific American, Apr 2013, 86, essentially uses a >> >> >"similarity" argument coupled with Occam's Razor. Shermer states: >> >> >"Migraine headaches also produce halluncinations, which Sacks >> >> >[neurologist Oliver Sacks] himself has experienced as a longtime >> >> >sufferer, including a 'shimmering light' that was 'dazzlingly bring'" >> >> >etc, etc, clouds, blah, blah. >> >> >Then Shermer goes on to make the comparison: "Compare Sack's experience >> >> >with that of Alexander's trip to heaven, where he was "in a place of >> >> >clouds. Big, puffy, pink-white ones that showed up sharply against the >> >> >deep blue-black sky. Higher than the clouds - immeasurably higher - >> >> >flocks of transparent, shimmering beings arced across the sky, leaving >> >> >long, streamerlike lines behind them.". >> >> >... >> >> >Then Shermer says "In any case, there is a reason they are called >> >> >'near'-death experiences: the people who have then are not actually >> >> >dead". Also he inquires how Alexander could have a memory of the >> >> >experiences. >> >> >. >> >> >Finally, Dr. Shermer states "To me, this evidence is proof of >> >> >hallucination, not heaven." >> >> >. >> >> >[his arguments on the whole are similar to those of Sam Harris]. >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > > > > >
