Oh, super, Emily. That is NOT easy reading; I really had to struggle with it. It seems like one has to master a whole new conceptual vocabulary, but it's worth it. I found the ideas exhilarating once I'd caught on, and it sounds as if you do too.
Both Ehrenreich and Douthat should read it! ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, <emilymaenot@...> wrote : "Scientists need to get some philosophy under their belts so they see what the problem is." I'm reading that Denys Turner book you posted here awhile back. Loving it - dense as it is. I can pick it up and open it to any place and be surprised over and over at the way it affects me. It's all new to me and I find it fascinating. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, <authfriend@...> wrote : Glad you enjoyed it, Emily. It certainly is an unusual pair of pieces to appear in the NYTimes! Her new book, from which she adapted her piece, has created something of a stir. From what I understand, it's completely unlike anything she's ever written and has really startled people who were familiar with her work and thought they knew who she was and what she stood for. Must have taken guts to publish it. And so odd to for her to have had that wild experience a half-century ago but not really have tried to come to terms with it until very recently. But it's great to see somebody of stature saying, "WAAAIIIIIT a minute, folks, there's more going on here than you realize. You can't just shut it out and pretend it doesn't exist." On the other hand, I think Douthat nails it where scientific investigation is concerned. We are still SO far away from understanding everyday consciousness, let alone mystical, nuomenal consciousness. But boy, it's long past time for science to start taking it seriously and realizing the limits of neuroscience to figure it out. Scientists need to get some philosophy under their belts so they see what the problem is. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, <emilymaenot@...> wrote : Judy, wonderful post. I loved Ross Douthat's article. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, <authfriend@...> wrote : A fascinating exchange of views... Opinion piece in the NYTimes by Barbara Ehrenreich, rationalist author and political activist (and atheist), about the change in her perspective on life wrought gradually over many years by a mystical experience she had as an adolescent (note: at age 73, she's still an atheist): http://www.nytimes.com/2014/04/06/opinion/sunday/a-rationalists-mystical-moment.html http://www.nytimes.com/2014/04/06/opinion/sunday/a-rationalists-mystical-moment.html Response by NYTimes columnist Ross Douthat (not an atheist) pointing out that her call for science to investigate mystical experiences in depth is premature because science doesn't yet understand ordinary experience well enough: http://douthat.blogs.nytimes.com/2014/04/09/how-to-study-the-numinous/ http://douthat.blogs.nytimes.com/2014/04/09/how-to-study-the-numinous/
