Fred Travis doesn't publish research on Maharishi AYurveda that I am aware of.
And I was not defending any claims made anywhere by MMY or anyone else (other than Travis' specific findings in his research, which are always, of course, subject to challenge by replicating his research). L ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, <no_re...@yahoogroups.com> wrote : I love the way you say "merely" wrong about something. But you are a master at making all this insanity seem reasonable. What you have to remember is that for most people in the TMO Marshy was incapable of being wrong about something and they act accordingly no matter how contradictory or just plain stupid his ideas were. There are two important things here. First is that MJ is right, the TMO tries on all sorts of crap just to make money. None of it is tested in anyway other than in having a few true believers say they had a good "experience" while doing it. Take MVVT for instance, a masterstroke in that it depends entirely for it's perceived credibility on people having read King Tony's book which came out a few years earlier. I was on a long rounding course when MVVT was introduced and was to be tried on people at a discount price to get feedback for the brochures. I predicted to all who would listen (not many) that it would work out to have the same effectiveness as a placebo, I thought it might be better slightly because of the self-selecting group of volunteers but no, a placebo it is. Was it removed from the Marshy catalogue of products? No. And nor was anything else that gets sold based on the myth of vedic superiority, like yagyas or just plain ayurveda itself. I still get monthly notices that an expert in this "world's greatest system of natural healthcare" is visiting the country with his "time tested" formulas for perfect health. The fact that the TMO has been sued many times because of poisonous medicines isn't mentioned anywhere. And the first thing any sensible ayurvedic doctor does when a patient gets ill is recommend they go to a specialist! They often ignore that advice and effectively kill themselves by relying on rasayanas but that's brainwashing for you. You couldn't make this stuff up. But people really honestly believe it still regardless of the contrary evidence. At best it's folie a deux, at worst they know damn well that Marshy products, like yagyas or amrit kalash, aren't any better than not doing anything at all and should quit it. PS "Time tested". What does that even mean? ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, <LEnglish5@...> wrote : Well, "enlightened" is such a vague term. Fred Travis' studies on enlightened TMers (preliminary CC) don't assert that they are perfect, only that they report a certain kind of internal "experience" and that there is a physiological pattern associated with the self-reports. It says nothing about whether they are correct in everything that they do. That was Maharishi's thing: to assert that enlightened people (meeting his definition) were going to be perfect in some way. As for spin-doctoring, this assertion from you has no basis in fact, but is merely your desire to show that Maharishi was a bad person, rather than merely wrong about something: The more likely cause of these folks deaths are that Marshy didn't know a damn thing about ayurveda and simply used it as another spring board to financial comfort for Marshy and family. The fact that he used human lives in his hunt for fame and comfort is I am sure incidental to Indian sensibilities but seems rather cavalier to us in the West. L ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, <mjackson74@...> wrote : How can that be if he was enlightened? And what part of my erudite writing do you feel is spin doctored? -------------------------------------------- On Sun, 4/27/14, LEnglish5@... mailto:LEnglish5@... <LEnglish5@... mailto:LEnglish5@...> wrote: Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Brahmachari Girish Varma Ji is to be praised To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Date: Sunday, April 27, 2014, 4:03 PM The most likely cause of the deaths is that Ayurveda, Maharishi or otherwise, isn't as perfect as Maharishi thought it was. The rest is spin-doctoring on your part. L ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, <mjackson74@...> wrote : Refined mercury is not used in every single ayurvedic formula for every ailment under the sun. Given the fact that lots of terminally ill patients with various kinds of ailments went to this clinic, it is unlikely that every formula used called for mercury and as you know ayurveda doesn't just rely on herbal formulas - there are a lot of techniques that traditional ayurved uses that don't involve herbs at all such as oil pulling routines. The PR that was always done on Maharishi Ayurveda since its first unveiling in 1986 was that Marshy was able, with his enlightened awareness to "cognize the full value of natural law" in the now fragmented and incomplete practice of ayurveda, thus ayurveda was "re-enlivened in terms of its fundamental principles by Maharishi Mahesh Yogi in collaboration with leading Ayurvedic physicians and restored to its completeness." I heard Bevan say many a time at MIU that Marshy's enlightened awareness enabled him to cognize all the various deep and subtle aspects of ayurveda that had been missing for centuries in India and thus ahd restored ayurveda to its fullness. If that were the case, it seems clear that it would be impossible to for there to be a lack of knowledge or technique on how to refine the mercury to the proper level. Also given the fact that in India they still use heavy metals that have been refined in various ayurvedic formulas with no apparent ill effect and the fact that ayurvedic big shots like Balraj Maharshi, Dwivedi and especially Triguna were "working" with Marshy, seems impossible that such lack of technique could exist, although in Triguna's case everyone I ever heard from who had a consultation with him said it was a blast to see him especially in India where his followers would run around like Keystone cops doing his bidding cause he was so famous, yet none of them were ever cured of their ailments by his herbal prescriptions. The more likely cause of these folks deaths are that Marshy didn't know a damn thing about ayurveda and simply used it as another spring board to financial comfort for Marshy and family. The fact that he used human lives in his hunt for fame and comfort is I am sure incidental to Indian sensibilities but seems rather cavalier to us in the West. -------------------------------------------- On Sun, 4/27/14, nablusoss1008 <no_re...@yahoogroups.com mailto:no_re...@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Brahmachari Girish Varma Ji is to be praised To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Date: Sunday, April 27, 2014, 12:16 PM Ayurved has some very powerful tools for boosting the immunesystem and for rejuvenation. Triguna was behind the efforts for terminally ill patients so the question is why it wasn't more successful. From what I've heard it boils down to the failure in purifying mercury which is vital in many of the recipy's. Maharishi through millions on this particular project and had top Vaidyas working on this since early 80's in Seelisberg. The day that is safely possible Ayurveda will revamp medicine. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, <LEnglish5@...> wrote : You know as much as I do: they built this massive 5-star facility that was The Raj on steroids, and invited terminal patients from all over the world to come and get cured. They died. Virtually all of them died. Not surprising since only the absolute, most hopeless cases were supposed to come in the first place as their last hope. It was meant to show the utter superiority of Maharishi Ayurveda Done Right™ to the World. And... They died. Virtually all of them died. End of story. Maharishi told the Movement to just "walk away" from such a place of death and they did. The place is now just ruins. L ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, <mjackson74@...> wrote : I have never heard this story of the failure of TM ayurveda - got any details? -------------------------------------------- On Sat, 4/26/14, LEnglish5@... <LEnglish5@...> wrote: Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Brahmachari Girish Varma Ji is to be praised To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Date: Saturday, April 26, 2014, 5:15 PM I don't speak any Indian language, but none of the English reports I have seen (including the links below) say that Girish has that kind of wealth, only that he is part of a 12-member committee that has control of that wealth (12,000 acres). And of course, if you actually look at the figures, the estimates of how much the land is worth is obviously exaggerated: the largest single item is the old Maharishi Ayurveda complex which now lies in utter disrepair. In its hey-day, it was meant to be The Raj on a grand scale: a complex of hospitals and hostels with 3200 5-star hotel rooms meant to provide an absolutely nourishing environment for those unfortunate people who were deemed "terminal" by Western medicine but could be saved due to the miraculous superiority of Ayurvedic treatments. When the masses of terminally ill patients did what Western treatment said would happened, and died by the thousands, Maharishi told the TM movement to "walk away" from the halls of death (or words to that effect) and the complex fell into complete ruin. It ain't worth $1.5 billion and there's no way it will ever be because it wasn't built as a 5-star *resort* but as a 5-star *hospital* and there's no way 3200 tourists at-a-time are going to want to pay 5-star prices to say in that particular region for any length of time. Without the promised miracle cures of Ayurveda, it is a completely worthless venture. L
