--- In [email protected], "Irmeli Mattsson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > --- In [email protected], TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > The thing that's fascinating to me is the "trickle- > > down craziness" involved with this. It's not just a > > case of some lazy fucks realizing that there is an > > easy way to avoid working, and that it's called > > begging. That's just one side of the phenomenon and > > of the conditioning. > > > > The other side of the conditioning is seen in the > > *sponsors*, the people who have been taught that > > there is some *benefit* to themselves that accrues > > when they pay so that these guys and gals never have > > to work. It's a remarkably symbiotic relationship; > > one side of the equation couldn't exist without > > the other. > > > > I know that a lot of people here and in spiritual > > trips in general just assume that this is all a given, > > and that it's always worked this way -- people who > > have chosen a full-time spiritual "career" being > > supported by those who have money and have chosen > > a more householder path. I'm challenging the very > > *idea* because I really believe that it's a *bad* > > idea, and that most of the problems that one can > > find in *any* spiritual tradition spring from this > > assumption, and from this practice. Historically, > > the spiritual traditions in which the monks or > > clergy pay their own way in life, and are *not* > > supported by the "rank and file" members of the > > organization, seem to me to be much cleaner and > > spiritually healthier. > > > > Just *think* about it for a moment -- it's one of > > the biggest scams in human history. In almost every > > era and in every tradition, all that you had to do > > to avoid getting a job like everybody else was to > > claim to be "spiritual" and get other people to pay > > so that you could be "spiritual" full time. I'm > > open to the possibility that many of these full-time > > teachers might have done a few nice things for the > > world, but when you look at it objectively, it's > > really quite amazing that no one really challenges > > the status quo of this whole scene and questions > > it. The meme of the rank-and-file rabble paying > > for the lives of the spiritual elite is that > > taken for granted, that ingrained in the collective > > consciousness. > > **** > This is healthy questioning. > > The kind of giving where you buy yourself a good conscience and a > better feeling of yourself by the giving, makes me feel quite > uncomfortable. It could be healthy to ask oneself: why do I need to > buy myself a good conscience?
And who made the connection in people's minds between giving MONEY and "buying themselves" a benefit, be it a better life in the hereafter or better karma or a clear conscience? Could it possibly have been...uh... the people who were *receiving* the money? You can bet your booties it wasn't the people giving it. :-) <snip> > The idea of people in spiritual organizations living luxurious > lives through actively collecting support money feels disgusting. More often than not, it's justified either with "He/She is a saint and thus deserves to live in comfort" or "He/She paid his/her dues living in caves in previous lives, and so this time around deserves a better life." The bottom line is always "deserves." > Even more disgusting feels the present trend in many > organizations to collect money to charity purposes and then > actually use at least part of that money to empire building > for your organization and your own luxurious life. As I pointed out recently, this is exactly the story of the United Way. Less than 40 cents of each dollar they collect goes to actual charities; the rest goes to supporting the organization and paying its upper echelon fairly large salaries. Same thing, sadly, with many "umbrella" charitable organizations. And I think that anyone who has been following things here understands that the chances of any money they donate to the TM organization actually being used for the purpose that it's supposed to be used for are nil. ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> Join modern day disciples reach the disfigured and poor with hope and healing http://us.click.yahoo.com/lMct6A/Vp3LAA/i1hLAA/UlWolB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
