--- In [email protected], "shempmcgurk" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > The insult of the cartoons is to all muslims. > Oh, really? > > You speak for all Muslims, do you? The insult is directed to all muslims as it has Mohammed as its object. If somebody feels insulted is another thing > Cardmeister -- I think it was -- posted a cartoon about MMY and > piles 'o money. I'm not offended even though I do TM. But TM is not a religion. Doing TM doesn't mean that you regard MMY as messenger of God. And judging from your output here you don't. So, you can't compare. > I suggest to you that a cartoon of Muhammed with a bomb as a turban > may insult some Muslims...perhaps those that don't have a sense of > humour, are very sensitive, The comic is dericted to muslims in general and is certainly potentially insulting. Barrys point about identification here is interesting, but as islam forbids depicting its founder in images, it is actually a transgression of islamic law, and on top of that insulting to its founder. I detect from that, that insults of its founder a good muslim is certainly forbidden to engage in. So its quite certain that this is an obvious provocation of muslim values. You seem to imply, that the ability to laugh about oneself, is a good value (maybe as one is able to acknowledge ones own faults), and that muslims should apply this to there religious ideal as well. But I regard this as cultural arrogance. > or are conflicted about whether or not > terrorism is justified. Here you go again: what has depicting Mohammed as a terrorist to do with justifying terrorism. Lets say, I publish a picture showing you as murderer, do you justify murder if you feel insulted by it? Strange logic. > Those that are well-grounded in their faith are probably not > bothered at all. Maybe, but thats no reason to insult them > > Ammachi speaks about the > > impact of these on the muslims in general. > > I believe that she was addressing those that were doing the killing > and the destruction of property. In what way do you thing her words imply these killings and destructions? Could you point these words out to us? I think you got it terribly wrong. Something is twisted in your brain. > > What's the reason that you > > equate them with murderers? > I don't and I didn't equat ALL Muslims with murderes. You do, when you say that she was addressing those doing the killing. > I do equate those that DID murder with murder. But how do they even come into the picture in Ammachis quote? > > Why do you bring those cases up, who react > > in the wrong way, to justify the cartoons, > When did I justify the cartoons? So, you don't justify the cartoons? You think they are harmful? Then whats the point? > > who insult all muslims, by > > mocking at their idol as a terrorist? > You've got it all wrong, bub. Muslims aren't allowed to have > Muhammed displayed as an idol. Sure, but the transgression of one law doesn't justify the transgression of a second. There were many cases where Mohammed was depicted in our press, which didn't cause Muslim protests, as there was no bad intention in them. > > There is no reason to insult anybodies religion - be it a majority > or > > a minority. > I disagree. That explains a lot, thank you. > There is VERY OFTEN reasons to insult religions. I can think of a > dozen reasons right off the top of my head. The top of your head? Where is that? > >(I don't know why this even needs to be discussed) There is > > even no reason to insult someones religion, even though he may be > one > > of these misguided persons, who are terrorists. You may insult > their > > actions, but not their religion. > Are you suggesting that laws should be passed to prevent anyone > from "insulting" religions? Didn't speak about laws. I think it should be part of the ethic code of journalists. > > If Ammachi asks to respect religious feelings of the muslims, she > is > > indeed NOT putting gasoline into the fire. To ask for a reconcilary > > attitude is very appropriate action. So, she is right on, and I > think > > it would be good if all religious leaders react in a similar way. > > AFAIK the pope said something similar. > > > > Show me what he said...if it's like what Amma said, then I'll be > happy to disagree with him as well (I disagree with him on alot of > things!) I remember seeing in TV, that he said that we should not show disrespect towards other religions. What he said was very apt for a religious leader. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/4734454.stm Speaking to the new Moroccan ambassador to the Vatican, Pope Benedict said religious symbols must be respected to promote peace and understanding between different peoples. "It is necessary and urgent that religions and their symbols are respected, and that believers are not the object of provocations that harm their progress and their religious feelings," he said. "However, intolerance and violence can never be justified as responses to offences," he warned. Very right I think, and completely in line of what Ammachi said. ------------------------ Yahoo! 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