According to my count, all of the narrations begin 5 seconds (up to 4 frames at 24fps, less in most cases) before the next image appears, with one second of black between the burnt and the "raw."
> But Segal is so wrong: no narration begins 15 to 20 seconds *after* the next > photograph appears; they all begin before. That's not a precision problem; > that's a version problem. At least I think so. She can't have made this > kind of mistake, no? > > But now I have Premiere open and I'm measuring the audio and visual cuts… > Back to you in a bit! > > j > > > > > On Mar 4, 2016, at 6:20 PM, Michael Zryd <z...@yorku.ca> wrote: > >> I don’t think there are two distinct versions. I suspect (though to be >> honest I haven’t used a stop watch to time it) that Shira may be ascribing a >> precision to the film which it in fact lacks—though the ascription is >> entirely understandable since, as a foundational ‘structural film’ using a >> strategy of repetition, (nostalgia) invites an expectation that it’s all >> worked out in advance, and that each unit is structurally consistent. >> >> But each photo burns differently (the photographic paper is likely >> different), and (at least according to an analysis by Steina at the ZKM show >> on Buffalo Media Study) each segment has a slightly different length. >> >> There’s an interesting study to be done on differing descriptions of >> experimental films to explore the different ways in which we see, describe, >> and interpret these works. >> >>> On Mar 4, 2016, at 2:31 PM, John Muse <jm...@sonic.net> wrote: >>> >>> But is the Treasures version the one Segal describes, and is that the, um, >>> authorized version? And is the one on the Odyssey collection, which Brand >>> worked on too, authorized as well? Are there two distinct versions >>> circulating? >>> >>> I just had that Treasures comp in my hands, but I returned it to our >>> library. Dang! >>> >>> j >>> >>> On Mar 4, 2016, at 2:48 PM, Mark Toscano <mrkt...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>>> The transfer on the Treasures IV set was supervised by the inimitable Mr >>>> Bill Brand, who knows the films intimately, and also has helped supervise >>>> restorations and digital mastering of numerous other Frampton films. >>>> >>>> Mark T >>>> >>>> On Fri, Mar 4, 2016 at 10:22 AM, Ken Eisenstein <ken7...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> Cf. the version on Treasures >>>> >>>> http://www.filmpreservation.org/dvds-and-books/treasures-iv-american-avant-garde-film >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Fri, Mar 4, 2016 at 1:06 PM, John Muse <jm...@sonic.net> wrote: >>>> Having checked with the usual suspects, I'm at a loss to explain the >>>> discrepancy between the version of (nostalgia) on the 2012 Criterion disk >>>> and the version described by a few folks, one being Shari Segal, who in a >>>> 2005 essay entitled From the Private to the Public" writes: >>>> >>>>> Each voice-over begins fifteen to twenty seconds after the new photograph >>>>> appears, precisely the amount of time permitted before the photograph’s >>>>> destruction visibly begins. >>>> >>>> This doesn't describe the voice-over to image relationship I see in the >>>> 2012 disk. The voice-overs begin before the new image arrives, not 20 >>>> seconds after. Is she wrong? Or did she see a different film? >>>> >>>> Clues? And I apologize if the answer is obvious. >>>> >>>> j/PrM >>>> >>>> ************************************************* >>>> >>>> john muse >>>> visiting assistant professor of independent college programs >>>> haverford college >>>> http://www.finleymuse.com >>>> http://www.haverford.edu/faculty/jmuse >>>> http://haverford.academia.edu/JohnMuse >>>> >>>> ************************************************* >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> FrameWorks mailing list >>>> FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com >>>> https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> FrameWorks mailing list >>>> FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com >>>> https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> FrameWorks mailing list >>>> FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com >>>> https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks >>> >>> j/PrM >>> >>> ************************************************* >>> >>> john muse >>> visiting assistant professor of independent college programs >>> haverford college >>> http://www.finleymuse.com >>> http://www.haverford.edu/faculty/jmuse >>> http://haverford.academia.edu/JohnMuse >>> >>> ************************************************* >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> FrameWorks mailing list >>> FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com >>> https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks >>> >> >> Michael Zryd • Associate Professor >> Department of Cinema & Media Arts >> School of the Arts, Media, Performance & Design >> >> YORK UNIVERSITY >> York Lanes 230 • 4700 Keele Street >> Toronto ON • Canada M3J 1P3 >> T 416.736.2100 x66957 / cell: 647-430-8680 / Skype: mjpzryd >> z...@yorku.ca • http://ampd.yorku.ca/about-us/our-faculty/michael-zryd • >> ampd.yorku.ca >> >> >> York University, one of 2015 Canada’s Greenest Employers >> >> >> This electronic mail (e-mail), including any attachments, is intended only >> for the recipient(s) to whom it is addressed and may contain information >> that is privileged, confidential and/or exempt from disclosure. 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If you have received this e-mail in error, >> or are not named as a recipient, please immediately notify the sender and >> destroy all copies of it. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> FrameWorks mailing list >> FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com >> https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks >> > > j/PrM > > ************************************************* > > john muse > visiting assistant professor of independent college programs > haverford college > http://www.finleymuse.com > http://www.haverford.edu/faculty/jmuse > http://haverford.academia.edu/JohnMuse > > ************************************************* > > > _______________________________________________ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks
