Nick (from a private conversation with you, hereby taken public) -
The subject is, Is there anything about the emergence of any higher
order property, behavior, etc., that is a Mystery … a question not
likely to be dissipated by the stubborn advance of ordinary science.
Ah... this is a well-put question I think.
I don’t think so: you do (right?)
I am not sure. I think "Mystery" may be an illusion, but a compelling
one. I don't need to pretend not to experience "Mystery" in the face of
overwhelming "mystery".
But similarly, I'm not sure I need to invoke Mystery as an alternative
to my ignorance or limited perspective. I strongly suspect that
Mystery is a receding horizon... that we can pursue answers to
questions posed by our skyline by approaching it, only to find each
summit a false one. I don't expect we will ever finish the journey,
complete the quest, grasp the grail. We will merely take the journeys,
experience the Mystery while we solve the mysteries, some crudely, some
eloquently.
and Glen -
Well, you've gone_way_ beyond what I'm using as my operational
definition. I'd like to stick with_humans_, meaning not only the
genome but also the morphology.
I agree that there is a very interesting conversation about the human
mind to be had. I actually *limited* my own working definition even
more, to be my centered around the only thing I think I know much at all
about which is, in fact, my own subjective experience of my own mind(s)
juxtaposed with the many projections I have of that "mind" onto other
(usually only human's) behaviour.
The other stuff was just my covering the bases and avoiding overly
constraining too early.
So I *think* you are speaking as much about identity as mind, which I
suppose I do not separate much myself.
I too have direct experience with the vagaries of aging and it's effect
on the mind. I helped my wife "walk her father to death" over 7 years
of Alzheimers' and then more recently have been engaged with my own
Father's walk down a similar path of aphasia and memory (but not
identity) loss. I also have the experience of someone very close to me
who believes she is walking the path of memory and identity loss unto
nonexistence... the jury is still out, but there are signs for sure. My
own aging process has lead me to leave behind "selves" which appear to
no longer exist, mostly around physical ability, but also mental, memory
and attention at the forefront.
I believe that this is a modern plague brought to us by having learned
to avoid many of the heart/brain maladies of the last generations... my
motto is "what doesn't kill you leaves you open to something worse".
I have huge experiences around what might be diagnoseable as multiple
personality disorder. I do not need blood sugar swings nor the singing
of yoghurt biochemistry in my gut (though I don't dismiss that these can
cause such experiences) to rotor through a wide range of internal
personality states. This list is subject to but one or two of my
personalities, and those who know me in person probably apprehend at
least a couple of others. Aside from the possibility that I also have
episodes I'm totally unaware of (what mean's "I"?), all of my distinct
(but blurred) identities/selves/personalities/modes are fully aware of
eachother. For example, as "I" write this there is a voice in my head
rolling his eyes and muttering "there he goes again, maybe one of us
should just hit <delete>?". And just for the fun of it, you should know
that the eye-rolling one (or another) actually does get the <delete> key
pressed as often as not here.
I do not know (sure, maybe I should seek professional help<grin>) why
this is my experience or why it does not disturb me (the me's that are
me?) more... I feel not like a cacophany of strangers but a clan of
brothers (and a couple of sisters?), all of a single body and memory but
of many different minds. Many differing minds/personalities joined in a
weak telepathy, sharing a common memory, but having wildly different
opinions and conclusions about the shared experience. It all sounds a
bit psychotic when I say it here, but except (perhaps?) for my missives
here, I am apparently pretty functional in society despite this.
So breaking out of this strange anecdote... I guess I should just ask..
Is this what you are calling key to mind? Identity?
- Sieve
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