'Abuse' emails and court orders are very different. On Thu, Sep 29, 2011 at 1:59 PM, xD 0x41 <[email protected]> wrote:
> err, you are limited in those countries dude... id really checkup on that > ... maybe some but, yea i agree, i dont think any hosting is anon, but, i > sure know i have kept an anon dedis in past, and was VERY easy to avoid > handing anything over. Unless they had personally seized from my company, i > was allowed to basically get away with, and if i want to, again, could do > the same 'anonymously' and, indeed keep those details, away. > it is not frigin hard dude, where did Yyou get the idea, that is not hard > to move a user around boxes :P > and rename them, etc etc etc, always change ipv6 tunnels... there is > somany ways, you obv have not ran a dedicated server in a company > environment coz boi, they hide nets on legit hostin now, legit apparently* > companies...and they do it using those simple means, and, even show logs of > them 'removing and deleting' files of the apprent 'bad user' , this is, a > whole different level than even needing to deal with cops.. so, you are > scared too much by laws wich can be smokescreened. > Run a dedis, or simply ask a admin, howmany abuse they get, and howmany > users they actually rm ;) > you would want this service, on your vps ? > i surely wouldnt,. i know, with me, if i offer anon, you stay damn anon, if > you bring cops to MY HOUSE, then i may have to try and, simply keep my darn > data secure ey ? > how about that ? > simple methods, defeat simple plans benji. > xd > > > > On 29 September 2011 22:53, Benji <[email protected]> wrote: > >> Yes they do. If you buy a server in America for example, even if you are >> located in Russia, they are required by federal law to hand over your >> details wherever you may reside. I dont know where you've obtained this idea >> that they can't. >> >> Just because something is advertised as 'anonymous' doesnt mean it's 'so >> anonymous you can break the law' and anyone using a EU/US-related country to >> do this is either stupid or naive. >> >> On Thu, Sep 29, 2011 at 1:50 PM, xD 0x41 <[email protected]> wrote: >> >>> They advertised as anonymous VPN to 'everyone'. >>> Then, that would mean, especially NOT locally, thats something wich is >>> also, subject to federal laws though so, in its own country, the provider >>> may have to, nomatter whats advertised, BUT outside of country customers, >>> should not be handed over. >>> isp's here dont do it, and havent, for like 20 yrs, they also do not take >>> down people,issue nor execute other peoples 'takedown orders', there is many >>> reasons for this but basically, they loose money from it. >>> Anyhow, in UK, you maybe right, but outside of there, then, they should >>> have maybe not advertised as anononymous vpn services for everyone and >>> anyone. thats obvious crap we know now. >>> anyhow, cheers, >>> xd >>> >>> >>> >>> On 29 September 2011 22:45, Benji <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >>>> Im sorry, why is it 'worrying' that a vpn provider that was a UK >>>> business and was located in the UK, is subject to UK law? >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Thu, Sep 29, 2011 at 9:51 AM, Darren Martyn < >>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Again, I hope this does not fail to send. >>>>> The reasoning behind the "Pure Elite" recruitment channel was A: to >>>>> recruit some talented people (and, by all accounts, there were some >>>>> talented >>>>> programmers there) and B: development and idle talk. Now more interesting >>>>> was the reasoning behind the name - by putting the developers and coders >>>>> and >>>>> potential recruits in a channel named "Pure Elite", it was essentially an >>>>> ego boost for the new guys, made them feel valued, etc, when in fact most >>>>> were but pawns to be used (IMHO). >>>>> >>>>> This co-operation between VPN providers and LEO, while being nothing >>>>> new - remember how hushmail caved in - is indeed worrying for those of us >>>>> who are privacy advocates as well as security researchers. >>>>> >>>>> On a more direct note, Laurelei, do not presume that you know all there >>>>> is to know about them. Doing so would be foolish. (Now don't go assuming >>>>> that I hate you, I bear you bugger all ill-will, etc). >>>>> Good day. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Wed, Sep 28, 2011 at 5:44 AM, Laurelai Storm <[email protected] >>>>> > wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Its all good dude. What really concerns me is that vpn providers might >>>>>> give over logs to oppressive regemes. TOR is starting to look better and >>>>>> better. >>>>>> On Sep 27, 2011 11:40 PM, "GloW - XD" <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>>> > never did... was only for one buttcheek kid that i was alittle >>>>>> pissed and >>>>>> > thinking things wich, prolly were wrong at the time... >>>>>> > I am adult enough to apologise for what happened back then, and >>>>>> hopefully it >>>>>> > is just, cool. >>>>>> > :) >>>>>> > cheers, your loved by many, you just have many trollers to :sp >>>>>> > take care , >>>>>> > xd >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > On 28 September 2011 14:32, Laurelai Storm <[email protected]> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> > >>>>>> >> Im suprised, someone on the internet who *doesn't * hate me :p >>>>>> >> On Sep 27, 2011 11:29 PM, "GloW - XD" <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>>> >> > Hello Laurelai , >>>>>> >> > Oh i agree it is still a terrible precedent to be set.. I dont >>>>>> even know >>>>>> >> > where, legally, i stand anymore... >>>>>> >> > It is rather disturbing, nomatter WHO it was laurela. >>>>>> >> > I am all for the hatred against the VPN provs, and this is not >>>>>> just >>>>>> >> > happening here, and i made a BIG statement about this, and >>>>>> privacy, in my >>>>>> >> > channel on efnet, first as i saw it. >>>>>> >> > >>>>>> >> > Then saw a torrentfreak feed,of someone who was an owner of a >>>>>> huge >>>>>> >> torrent >>>>>> >> > site, was handed to authorities, not by the hoster, no... but by >>>>>> the >>>>>> >> > frigging payment handler, ie paypal or alertpay most likely. >>>>>> >> > >>>>>> >> > This is not good, it makes a grey could now over what is 'anon' >>>>>> and what >>>>>> >> > isnt. and thats a bad thing for us all. >>>>>> >> > To much fraud is causing this, thats plain and simple.Abusing >>>>>> places like >>>>>> >> > Sony, and, major banks, only make the authorities turn to >>>>>> politics, whom >>>>>> >> in >>>>>> >> > turn can bully with federal and state laws of ANY country, i >>>>>> think this >>>>>> >> is >>>>>> >> > the dangerous part wich is affecting lulzsec members or whoever >>>>>> was apart >>>>>> >> of >>>>>> >> > it, and, i mean efnet is no recruiting grounds for decent hkrs. >>>>>> >> > Simple as that, you know it, maybe thru word of mouth ok, but not >>>>>> alone >>>>>> >> by >>>>>> >> > being in channels but that network, is one federal hideout >>>>>> now..and, that >>>>>> >> is >>>>>> >> > every channel, if it is not being spied (yea they have a module >>>>>> >> > m_spychannel.c or similar, wich, they actually had without >>>>>> realising, >>>>>> >> asked >>>>>> >> > a friend, to code for them. >>>>>> >> > This was rejected by me/her,but i believe they have the module >>>>>> running >>>>>> >> now. >>>>>> >> > So, what was to stop them adding theyre own hidden spy mode to it >>>>>> :s look >>>>>> >> at >>>>>> >> > what they did to my old channel #haqnet, they introduced drinemon >>>>>> and a >>>>>> >> > bunch of other things, when it could have been simply worked out >>>>>> with >>>>>> >> > words.. but anyhow, i will not brood on the past, i hope this is >>>>>> mutual >>>>>> >> > Laurelai, I have nothing bad to say about you, and in turn, >>>>>> expect the >>>>>> >> same. >>>>>> >> > Respect for respect dear. >>>>>> >> > I do agree with you about the situation and, as you can see, am >>>>>> not >>>>>> >> holding >>>>>> >> > 9undisclosed) crappy things wich happened along time ago, over >>>>>> one >>>>>> >> idiotic >>>>>> >> > kid, on efnet, whom now i know you do not associate with. So, i >>>>>> want >>>>>> >> that, >>>>>> >> > to be laid rest now.. please. >>>>>> >> > And, we can only hope that the greater common sense will prevail >>>>>> and >>>>>> >> > hopefully, places will be forced to proove anonymity in some way, >>>>>> wether >>>>>> >> > that be by showing people email interaction with requester's of >>>>>> peoples >>>>>> >> > info, or anything simple even, wich would be then a standard for >>>>>> VPN, I >>>>>> >> do >>>>>> >> > not use them but, if i bought anonymous vpn, id expect exactly >>>>>> >> that,without >>>>>> >> > political interaction and grey areas about who and what is now >>>>>> legal and >>>>>> >> not >>>>>> >> > legal on the internet, on chatrooms, and on even websites. >>>>>> >> > ok, thats plenty, cheers! >>>>>> >> > xd >>>>>> >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>> >> > On 28 September 2011 13:41, Laurelai <[email protected]> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >> > >>>>>> >> >> On 9/27/2011 10:10 PM, sandeep k wrote: >>>>>> >> >> >>>>>> >> >> Lolz members was really insane ,i m not why to use that crapy >>>>>> hma. >>>>>> >> >> On Sep 27, 2011 8:36 PM, "Ferenc Kovacs" <[email protected]> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >> >> > yeah, and usually the same goes for calling others "kids" ;) >>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>> >> >> > On Tue, Sep 27, 2011 at 10:30 PM, GloW - XD <[email protected]> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >> >> >> #pure-elite , rofl... yes indeed :P >>>>>> >> >> >> hehe... nice story tho...funny about the elite channel >>>>>> thing... why >>>>>> >> do >>>>>> >> >> ppl >>>>>> >> >> >> tag themselves as elite? usually when they are not... >>>>>> >> >> >> ohwell, thats efnut :s (irc sucks) >>>>>> >> >> >> xd >>>>>> >> >> >> >>>>>> >> >> >> >>>>>> >> >> >> On 27 September 2011 19:03, Darren Martyn >>>>>> >> >> >> <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>>> >> >> >>> >>>>>> >> >> >>> Hope this sends correctly, new email client and all... But >>>>>> seeing as >>>>>> >> it >>>>>> >> >> is >>>>>> >> >> >>> an international investigation many people have been bending >>>>>> over >>>>>> >> >> backwards >>>>>> >> >> >>> to assist LEO on this. HMA and perfect privacy were the >>>>>> VPN's of >>>>>> >> choice >>>>>> >> >> for >>>>>> >> >> >>> them it would appear, oh, and he was part of the #pure-elite >>>>>> channel >>>>>> >> on >>>>>> >> >> that >>>>>> >> >> >>> IRC server, and hence, considered by LEO and others as "Part >>>>>> of >>>>>> >> >> LulzSec". >>>>>> >> >> >>> >>>>>> >> >> >>> TL;DR, this is nothing new. >>>>>> >> >> >>> >>>>>> >> >> >>> On Tue, Sep 27, 2011 at 6:53 AM, Laurelai Storm < >>>>>> >> [email protected] >>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>> >> >> >>> wrote: >>>>>> >> >> >>>> >>>>>> >> >> >>>> And the guy wasnt even a part of lulzsec >>>>>> >> >> >>>> >>>>>> >> >> >>>> On Sep 26, 2011 10:37 PM, "Jeffrey Walton" < >>>>>> [email protected]> >>>>>> >> >> wrote: >>>>>> >> >> >>>> > On Mon, Sep 26, 2011 at 8:47 PM, Ivan . < >>>>>> [email protected]> >>>>>> >> wrote: >>>>>> >> >> >>>> >> >>>>>> >> >> >>>> >> >>>>>> >> >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>> http://www.h-online.com/security/news/item/VPN-provider-helped-track-down-alleged-LulzSec-member-1349666.html >>>>>> >> >> >>>> > Though HMA claims they complied with a court order, it >>>>>> looks as >>>>>> >> if >>>>>> >> >> >>>> > they facilitated a law enforcement request. The US and >>>>>> the FBI >>>>>> >> have >>>>>> >> >> no >>>>>> >> >> >>>> > jurisdiction in the UK. >>>>>> >> >> >>>> > >>>>>> >> >> >>>> > Jeff >>>>>> >> >> >>>> > >>>>>> >> >> >>>> > _______________________________________________ >>>>>> >> >> >>>> > Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. >>>>>> >> >> >>>> > Charter: >>>>>> http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html >>>>>> >> >> >>>> > Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/ >>>>>> >> >> >>>> >>>>>> >> >> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> >> >> >>>> Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. >>>>>> >> >> >>>> Charter: >>>>>> http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html >>>>>> >> >> >>>> Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/ >>>>>> >> >> >>> >>>>>> >> >> >>> >>>>>> >> >> >>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> >> >> >>> Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. >>>>>> >> >> >>> Charter: >>>>>> http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html >>>>>> >> >> >>> Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/ >>>>>> >> >> >> >>>>>> >> >> >> >>>>>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> >> >> >> Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. >>>>>> >> >> >> Charter: >>>>>> http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html >>>>>> >> >> >> Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/ >>>>>> >> >> >> >>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>> >> >> > -- >>>>>> >> >> > Ferenc Kovács >>>>>> >> >> > @Tyr43l - http://tyrael.hu >>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>> >> >> > _______________________________________________ >>>>>> >> >> > Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. >>>>>> >> >> > Charter: >>>>>> http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html >>>>>> >> >> > Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/ >>>>>> >> >> >>>>>> >> >> >>>>>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> >> >> Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. >>>>>> >> >> Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html >>>>>> >> >> Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/ >>>>>> >> >> >>>>>> >> >> >From my understanding they used the channel as a possible >>>>>> recruitment >>>>>> >> >> ground, though only 6 people were officially a part of lulzsec , >>>>>> i find >>>>>> >> it >>>>>> >> >> disturbing that law enforcement considers being in an irc >>>>>> channel >>>>>> >> tantamount >>>>>> >> >> to being a part of lulzsec. >>>>>> >> >> >>>>>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> >> >> Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. >>>>>> >> >> Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html >>>>>> >> >> Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/ >>>>>> >> >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. >>>>>> Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html >>>>>> Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/ >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. >>>>> Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html >>>>> Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/ >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. >>>> Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html >>>> Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/ >>>> >>> >>> >> >
_______________________________________________ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/
