I would like, and it might be a big help to others who haven't tried this sort of approach, to hear a recording of blind person playing such games, slowed down to a point to where you can hear the audible cues, have them explained during a short pause, then have the action continue. Sort of like descriptive narration at a slow pace, then hear the same sequence replayed at normal speed to hear the pace. The ideas are interesting even if it isn't my type of game.

---
Laughter is the best medicine, so look around, find a dose and take it to heart. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Scott Chesworth" <scottcheswo...@gmail.com>
To: "Gamers Discussion list" <gamers@audyssey.org>
Sent: Wednesday, February 09, 2011 8:19 AM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] A question for Clement and Yohandy re: play value of mainstream fighting games.



It does indeed mean that the punch has already landed, but that'd be
the same in an accessible version of the same game, or even in real
life would it not? Given that you've missed the chance to defend by
that point, it'd be time to either retreat or counter, and being able
to tell which attacks your opponent is launching, how close they'd
need to be to launch those attacks, the speed and individual fighting
styles of the characters in the game and gamers holding the
controllers are all contributing factors. Luckily, footsteps, dashes,
specials and the like often have sound cues associated with them
nowadays, so a gamer who's done their homework can often defend before
hearing that punch land, which was what you were asking I think. True,
you need quick reactions, but no quicker than the sighted person who's
just jumped back to avoid your attack or blocked your combo. They
didn't see that coming any sooner than you would've heard it if the
roles were reversed. It hasn't always been the case, but in this
particular genre, it's very possible now for blind people to be aware
of their surroundings and their opponents actions, so it's no longer
about who attacks hardest.

I'm not knocking your taste in games at all, if beat 'em ups aren't
your thing then that's one less person who's waiting in line to beat
me lol. As far as actual mastery of the in-game action goes though,
it's possible to be good at them now as a blind gamer, that's what I'm
getting at.

On 2/9/11, Charles Rivard <woofer...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
When you hear a punch, doesn't that indicate that it has already hit the
mark, in which case you're too late to defend against it?

---
Laughter is the best medicine, so look around, find a dose and take it to
heart.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Clement Chou" <chou.clem...@gmail.com>
To: "Gamers Discussion list" <gamers@audyssey.org>
Sent: Tuesday, February 08, 2011 5:34 PM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] A question for Clement and Yohandy re: play value of
mainstream fighting games.


Well said, Christopher... and I hear what you are saying completely. I can

explain it in some detail, but I'll answer more questions next week when I

have a new game to show, so I can walk people through things as I explore
for the first time.

In fighting games on this generation of consoles, there are sounds for
everything. A punch sounds different than a kick, a block sounds different

from a successful hit. Dashing has sounds, and so does jumping. There are
sounds for when a character uses a special attack such as a projectile
versus a straight hit, and using the sound of the projectile's launch and impact you can gage how far away from the screen you are or your opponent
is. Since fighting games are rarely about reloading weapons, you can put
that worry aside. The trick in a fighting game is to learn combos and
moves, but that requires no more effort than any sighted person. If you
seriously are interested in knowing more, feel free to write me offlist. I

would be glad to help in any way I can... I wanted to keep this
description short. But as I said, I'll do more showing with audio when I
get my hands on Marvel Vs. Capcom 3 next week.

At 02:54 PM 08/02/2011, you wrote:
Ok, I would like to understand something.  I have heard that there is a
lot
of complexity in the fighting games, planning strategies and the like. I
accept that this is true.



Now, I have no vision. Strategy planning involves reacting not only to my
opponent, but to the environment, my current life level and weapon load
(where appropriate) my opponent's condition, and any time-based factors.
So, how, as I said with no vision, do I get this input in order to make
the
tactical decisions that make the games worth playing?  Is there enough
information conveyed by sound to provide me with this state vector?



You see, this isn't a matter of being unwilling to put in effort, or
memorize a bunch of menu sequences. I figured out how to play Anacreon, a
complex space conquest game with a lot of things that defeat screen
readers
without a hell of a lot of effort, because the information was in fact
there
if one expended the effort.  As Anacreon was a turn-based game, I could
take
the time to find it, incorporate it into my understanding of the game
state
and make the complex decisions about production, fleet deployment and even battle tactics that the game required. The game rewarded me with exactly the experience a sighted player would have, though I had to put literally
tens of hours in just to figure out the interface, let alone the game
strategy.



I'm unconvinced that I would ever get that level of feedback, even with
substantial effort from a mainstream game of any sort.  Without that
feedback, I am at best operating at a severe disadvantage. Perhaps there are patterns that could bring me victory, there are patterns in say, Tank
commander that lead to a successful conquest of the levels, but the fact
is
that I could learn those patterns by trial and error with full game
feedback, rather than simply trying something, learning it didn't work and
trying something else.  I can diagnose *why* something didn't work.



So, if I am wrong about that, then I may be interested in exploring some
more mainstream gaming options.  But frankly, it's a very high bar, and
one
I have no interest in compromising about.  Life is too short to play a
game
at a disadvantage, no matter how wonderful the game might be. Or at least
that is my priority.



                Chris Bartlett



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