Dear Tom, dry leaves don't yield much biogas. We get about 100 litres biogas from a kg green leaves. They have to be macerated before introducing them into the digester. Yours A.D.Karve (Nandu for you)
On Wed, Jul 20, 2011 at 7:20 PM, Thomas Reed <[email protected]> wrote: > Dear Anand > > Of course, CO2. > > I live in Massachusetts, a heavily forested state. There are lots of green > leaves, but mostly up in the trees, so not available like Ag residues. > > In a few months they will fall. Will these leaves work? > > ( I presume not, because the tree takes the nutrients underground before > pushing off the husk.) > > Tom Reed > > Dr Thomas B Reed > President, The Biomass Energy Foundation > www.Woodgas.com > > On Jul 19, 2011, at 9:05 PM, Anand Karve <[email protected]> wrote: > >> Dear Tom, >> the right hand side of the equation should read CH4 +CO2. Secondly, >> one can use green leaves as feedstock in a biogas plant. >> They are always available in a tropical country like India, but may >> not be available in winter in Ukraine. For use in winter, one grows >> sugarbeet, which can be harvested in October and the harvested beet >> can stay in the open throughout the winter. In Germany they use corn >> as feedstock, but I feel that the advantage of sugarbeet lies in the >> fact that its biomass contains less lignin than other crops. >> Yours >> A.D.Karve >> >> On Wed, Jul 20, 2011 at 4:51 AM, Thomas Reed <[email protected]> wrote: >>> Dear Phillip >>> >>> The power generation sounds interesting. >>> >>> What is the feed sock for the digester? Carbohydrates? >>> >>> 2 CH2O ===> CH4 + H2O. >>> >>> A dr, carve in India has built a small digestor that produces all the >>> methane needed to cook the meals. >>> >>> I suppose a larger digester could supply the electric power too. >>> >>> Keep talking... >>> >>> Tom Reed >>> >>> Dr Thomas B Reed >>> President, The Biomass Energy Foundation >>> www.Woodgas.com >>> >>> On Jul 19, 2011, at 12:03 PM, phillip manske <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >>>> Hi Tom, >>>> >>>> Its good to hear from you. I taught ESL in Korea for six years and >>>> instead of coming back to the US directly, I went to Kiev and stayed >>>> in East Europe for year. I went to Moldova, Poland and Romania too. >>>> I lived on the money I saved while in Korea and my Fed government >>>> pension. I was poor there and I didn't do much but work on a website >>>> that was inspired by my Fed time. I made a large Freedom of >>>> Information Act program and I did most of the work in cafe's with free >>>> WiFi. >>>> >>>> Melitopol is in the Russian half of Ukraine, I generally like the >>>> Ukies better than the Russians but I think the women are more >>>> attractive. I've been to Melitopol twice already. No one visits >>>> Melitopol, its kind of a hole. Anna is an ethnic Russian living in >>>> Ukraine. >>>> >>>> http://khersongirls.com - that is the agency I recommend. Consider >>>> all of the others as scams. I've met the owner and I've been to the >>>> office many times. >>>> >>>> >>>> If you want to get involved with my "Gold" project you are welcome. >>>> Its gonna take some money but not much. My investor advisor says to >>>> make the lab reactor and then the GEK scale reactor. I think the lab >>>> reactor will look like this... >>>> >>>> http://www.chemglass.com/product_view.asp?pnr=CLS-1404 >>>> >>>> I don't want to appear as a Johnny come lately into biofuels but it >>>> kind of looks that way. I was an electrican in the navy a long time >>>> ago and I said I'd return to power generation if the things were >>>> right. The concept is complicated, the practice is easy. Once the >>>> gens run, there is no work to do. You just need to check the engines >>>> twice a day and that takes 20 minutes max each time. You really have >>>> the whole day off for the next fifteen years if you get a contract. >>>> >>>> That's whats up. >>>> >>>> Phillip >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Tue, Jul 19, 2011 at 7:31 AM, Thomas Reed <[email protected]> >>>> wrote: >>>>> So, do you have an office in Melitopol? Looks like it's close to the >>>>> black sea. >>>>> >>>>> Tom >>>>> >>>>> Dr Thomas B Reed >>>>> President, The Biomass Energy Foundation >>>>> www.Woodgas.com >>>>> >>>>> On Jul 18, 2011, at 10:25 PM, phillip manske <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Hi Dr. Reed, >>>>>> >>>>>> Thanks for the concern. I had to pay bills for two months and then I >>>>>> needed some cash so I can go marriage agency dates in Ukraine. I >>>>>> lived in Ukraine for a year so I kinda know whats up. I found a woman >>>>>> there that likes me. She looks like Meagan Fox but she has larger >>>>>> breasts. She sells cosmetics and lives in Melitopol. I work next to >>>>>> a corporate lake and the lake is feed by storm run off. The lake has >>>>>> some good wildlife and I have taken to turtle rescue when the chelons >>>>>> get stuck in the drainage pipes. I got ten already. I have a snapper >>>>>> hatchling and hand sized softshell on a shelf by my desk. >>>>>> >>>>>> That's pretty cool Phil but it has nothing to with biomass. >>>>>> >>>>>> I don't talk about gasifiers here because I don't know Jack. >>>>>> Sometimes you just need to shut up and listen. >>>>>> >>>>>> Yea so I decided I should read about the matter. >>>>>> This book is great. >>>>>> http://www.amazon.com/Transportation-Biofuels-Production-Biodiesel-Chemistry/dp/1849730431 >>>>>> >>>>>> I got an eCopy if you want to see the relevant material. The methane >>>>>> part looks way doable and in fact I'm slowly working on that. I found >>>>>> sciencedirect.com which has a great index and all of the papers on the >>>>>> matter are availalbe for free at the uni library but I don't have my >>>>>> Indiana drives lic/ID yet so its another two weeks. The papers come >>>>>> to $4500 if I have to pay. >>>>>> >>>>>> I wrote an executive summary for someone at GoBig and I after I sent >>>>>> that off they asked for an executive summary and asked a few other >>>>>> questions. I made a good post at GEK and I got ass kissy with Mr. >>>>>> Mason trying to amend my earlier offences. >>>>>> >>>>>> Whats up with you Tom? >>>>>> >>>>>> Warmest Regards >>>>>> >>>>>> Phillip >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Phillip Manske >>>>>> 195 w Puetz Rd h-114 >>>>>> Oak Creek WI, 53154 >>>>>> [email protected] >>>>>> >>>>>> Alchemy Fuels Executive Summary >>>>>> Saturday, July 16, 2011 >>>>>> >>>>>> The Energy Policy Act of 2005 has mandated that investor owned >>>>>> utilities must provide a certain amount of the energy they provide >>>>>> must be sourced from renewable sources. This amount has been >>>>>> regulated to grow both now and in the future. To date, wind and solar >>>>>> sources have been providing most of this energy while biomass sourced >>>>>> energy has lagged. Utilities have been rejecting new applications for >>>>>> wind and solar energies while courting biomass providers as many slots >>>>>> are still open. Alchemy has determined a course to make low cost >>>>>> biofuel to fulfill these requirements is a realistic and profitable >>>>>> goal. >>>>>> >>>>>> After reviewing scientific literature on the matter I, (working as >>>>>> Alchemy Fuels) have decided that a two stage reactor designed to make >>>>>> methane is the most efficient route to a biofuel called “biogas”. >>>>>> This method was developed early in the biofuels research efforts and >>>>>> then abandoned in favor of ethanol and other more lucrative >>>>>> transportation fuels. Methane is a well founded and well functioning >>>>>> fuel for generators designed to work with natural gas. This process >>>>>> is well reviewed and appreciated by the scientific community for its >>>>>> ease use and lack of exotic requirements. It can be described as a >>>>>> methane digester without the required tons of manure feedstock. The >>>>>> research was pioneered by a scientist named Gaddy who founded a >>>>>> company called BRI. The process is referred as the microbial catalyst >>>>>> cellulosic fuel pathway. >>>>>> >>>>>> The process uses the output from gasifiers that use wood mass as a >>>>>> feedstock. A handful of gases are provided by the gasifier with the >>>>>> most important being carbon monoxide and the lesser gases being >>>>>> hydrogen, carbon dioxide and methane. All of the gasses are used in >>>>>> the process. The first stage of the process uses a bacteria called p. >>>>>> productus that uses the CO for growth and CO2 for the production of >>>>>> acetate which is the feedstock for the second and final stage where a >>>>>> bacteria called m. barkeri uses the acetate and hydrogen to make >>>>>> methane. Methane, unlike ethanol , does not need distilling which >>>>>> saves considerable effort, energy and money. >>>>>> >>>>>> The market for the gas or gas use comes from the aforementioned lack >>>>>> of biomass energy providers. Contract length is from 10 – 20 years, >>>>>> amount of sale is typically 800 kilo watts per hour and the >>>>>> compensation is from $.10 - $.15 per Kw hour. Providers are >>>>>> typically allowed to provide 24 hours a day. Demand may vary but >>>>>> demand is typically strong. Biogas contracts are generally designed >>>>>> for methane digesters but this type of process meets the legal >>>>>> definition of biogas even without the $1 million digester. >>>>>> >>>>>> This is a niche market but it can provide excellent returns and a >>>>>> number of contracts can be signed simultaneously. Sales are assured, >>>>>> no distribution network is required. Plants like this operate at a >>>>>> technician level and not an engineer or scientist level. There are >>>>>> few critical points that may induce failure. The required insurance >>>>>> is difficult to get but I have found a provider and at least one work >>>>>> around method. >>>>>> >>>>>> Plants should be located near the biomass source to save money on >>>>>> transportation and when the gas is made, it can be shipped at much >>>>>> less expense to the generating facilities . The plants will be >>>>>> filled with wood biomass, gasifiers and vats that look like >>>>>> microbrewery vats. >>>>>> >>>>>> Being averse to large expenditures, I recommend a modest approach to >>>>>> first make a five gallon reactor using bottled gas, then a system >>>>>> using a small gasifier and then finally a system scaled to produce >>>>>> fuel at the rate to meet the 800 kwh limit. >>>>>> >>>>>> The described process above is worth study and investment. The >>>>>> science is sound, the investment and risk is small, operating overhead >>>>>> is very low and sales are guaranteed. It appears margins should be >>>>>> very wide unlike typical margins that are available to investors. >>>>>> >>>>>> Questions may be directed to me at the email address above. >>>>>> >>>>>> Regards >>>>>> >>>>>> Phillip Manske >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On Mon, Jul 18, 2011 at 9:46 PM, Thomas Reed <[email protected]> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> Phil >>>>>>> I haven't heard your name for.a decade or so. What cooks in biomass? >>>>>>> Tom Reed >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Dr Thomas B Reed >>>>>>> President, The Biomass Energy Foundation >>>>>>> www.Woodgas.com >>>>>>> On Jul 18, 2011, at 7:04 PM, >>>>>>> "[email protected]"<[email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Connected by DROID on Verizon Wireless >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> Gasification mailing list >>>>>>> >>>>>>> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address >>>>>>> [email protected] >>>>>>> >>>>>>> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page >>>>>>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org >>>>>>> >>>>>>> for more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web site: >>>>>>> http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/ >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> Gasification mailing list >>>>>>> >>>>>>> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address >>>>>>> [email protected] >>>>>>> >>>>>>> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page >>>>>>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org >>>>>>> >>>>>>> for more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web site: >>>>>>> http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/ >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> Gasification mailing list >>>>>> >>>>>> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address >>>>>> [email protected] >>>>>> >>>>>> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page >>>>>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org >>>>>> >>>>>> for more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web site: >>>>>> http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/ >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Gasification mailing list >>>>> >>>>> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address >>>>> [email protected] >>>>> >>>>> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page >>>>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org >>>>> >>>>> for more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web site: >>>>> http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/ >>>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Gasification mailing list >>>> >>>> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address >>>> [email protected] >>>> >>>> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page >>>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org >>>> >>>> for more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web site: >>>> http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/ >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Gasification mailing list >>> >>> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address >>> [email protected] >>> >>> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page >>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org >>> >>> for more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web site: >>> http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/ >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> *** >> Dr. A.D. Karve >> President, Appropriate Rural Technology Institute (ARTI) >> >> *Please change my email address in your records to: [email protected] * >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Gasification mailing list >> >> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address >> [email protected] >> >> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org >> >> for more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web site: >> http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/ > > _______________________________________________ > Gasification mailing list > > to Send a Message to the list, use the email address > [email protected] > > to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page > http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org > > for more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web site: > http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/ > -- *** Dr. A.D. Karve President, Appropriate Rural Technology Institute (ARTI) *Please change my email address in your records to: [email protected] * _______________________________________________ Gasification mailing list to Send a Message to the list, use the email address [email protected] to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org for more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web site: http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/
