If you are interested in teaching then the labs are a good way of creating material and present your ideas.
The students can read and experiment at the same time. The form edtitor is also a good way for you to test your ideas and present a different front end to J. http://groups.google.com/group/J-Programming/browse_thread/thread/22d3c6d5d516491e May give you an idea of what I mean. 2009/3/15 Don Watson <[email protected]> > No, that's not what I am trying to say. Except for the total > representation of J in ASCII symbols, J is similar in nature to APL in J > sentences. J becomes a vastly different language only when it moves into > tacit programming. This gives J a lot of power. Sticking to ASCII also adds > all the ease of communication and makes J independent of the machines on > which it is implemented. I don't believe there is any APL system > implemented > on so many operating systems. Since different schools use different > operating systems, this independence and communication is of vital > importance in teaching. J is also both free for educational use and a well > supported, thoroughly professional, reliable system. To me this suggests > that J is the base system of choice for experiential mathematics in > education. > > However, one person on this forum remarked that he used both APL and J > because they had different strengths. They were designed for different > purposes. The advantages of APL include the fact that it is very easy to > learn - which is of no interest to experienced J users - and thus more > suitable for the educational applications in which I am interested. I am > therefore looking for a way to marry the strengths of APL with the > strengths > of J. From what I have learned so far, this would be very easy to do and > none of the J experts like those on this forum would ever have to use it or > even know about it. > > Which raises the question of why I am talking on this forum to people > who have no interest in what I am talking about. The answer is that one > cannot deal with such things in isolation. Critics are essential to the > process. Ric made the following comment: "I apologize in advance if my > comments below seem to be rather negative but I hope, like me, you prefer > negative feedback to none!" The more critical you are, the more helpful you > are. You' be surprised how much help I have already received from this > forum. All of it has encouraged rather than discouraged me and I am very > grateful. > > You make one comment: "This can not be tacit because copula (=. =:) can > not appear inside a tacit form." I have two points. One is that in the > system variation that you would never see or use it should be possible to > make changes that, while consistent with the principles of J, make > something > that is a rule of J not a rule in the system variation I seek. For example, > one cannot insert J sentences in tacit programming. I want to do that. In > the example I gave, I used curly brackets to do it - because there aren't > any brackets left in the system. For the usage that you would never see or > use, It would be possible to use some form of bracket to move from tacit > programming to J sentences and back, just as (+/%#) moves from a J sentence > to tacit programming and back. In which case the rule "This can not be > tacit > because copula (=. =:) can not appear inside a tacit form." does not apply > and I can say: > > SD =. { %:(%N) * +/ *: } ( ] - (+/ % { N =. } #)) > > However, I do not deny the truth of your statement: "I suggest you to > forget APL for a moment and read introductory books such as "Programming in > J" or "J premier". I think I understand the principles of J, but I am very > short on the details. > > Don > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "bill lam" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Sunday, March 15, 2009 12:24 AM > Subject: Re: [Jgeneral] Teaching > > > > On Sat, 14 Mar 2009, Don Watson wrote: > >> anyway. For example, the primitives "@" and "@." seem to be saying: "I > >> want > >> to follow one verb with another. Since I'm in tacit programming, they > >> will > >> be treated as a fork. > > > > This is incorrect. @ and @. are not fork. They are conjunctions. The > > order of execution start from right to left. For fork, the middle > > token is also a verb ( v1 v2 v3 )_and order of execution of v1 > > relative to v3 is undefined. > > > >> SD =. { %:(%N) * +/ *: } ( ] - (+/ % { N =. } #)) > > > > This can not be tacit because copula (=. =:) can not appear inside a > > tacit form. > > > > I think that you are confused because you assume J is just APL with > > ascii symbol and your previous APL knowledge become a barrier for you > > to understand J. I suggest you to forget APL for a moment and read > > introductory books such as "Programming in J" or "J premier". No > > offense if it sounds like rtfm. > > > > -- > > regards, > > ==================================================== > > GPG key 1024D/4434BAB3 2008-08-24 > > gpg --keyserver subkeys.pgp.net --recv-keys 4434BAB3 > > 唐詩132 孟浩然 早寒江上有懷 > > 木落雁南渡 北風江上寒 我家襄水曲 遙隔楚雲端 > > 鄉淚客中盡 孤帆天際看 迷津欲有問 平海夕漫漫 > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm > -- Björn Helgason, Verkfræðingur Fugl&Fiskur ehf, Þerneyjarsundi 23, Hraunborgum Po Box 127,801 Selfoss , t-póst: [email protected] gsm: +3546985532 Landslags og skrúðgarðagerð, gröfuþjónusta http://groups.google.com/group/J-Programming Tæknikunnátta höndlar hið flókna, sköpunargáfa er meistari einfaldleikans góður kennari getur stigið á tær án þess að glansinn fari af skónum /|_ .-----------------------------------. ,' .\ / | Með léttri lund verður | ,--' _,' | Dagurinn í dag | / / | Enn betri en gærdagurinn | ( -. | `-----------------------------------' | ) | (\_ _/) (`-. '--.) (='.'=) ♖♘♗♕♔♙ `. )----' (")_(") ☃☠ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
