With one exception, I agree with John. The exception is that I think it has been demonstrated that one can clear an ice fog with seeding, and this has been done to open airports, etc.--not to generate precipitation (in any form).
I would add that the water vapor content of air and clouds above Greenland is likely so low that one could not be likely to get a significant buildup of snow. Whether one could seed storms or change sea surface temperatures in surrounding areas in a way that would lead to greater likelihood of storms depositing snow on Greenland (or Antarctica, etc.) has not, to my knowledge, been looked at at all. Mike On 12/16/09 4:00 AM, "John Latham" <[email protected]> wrote: > Hello Neil, Andrew et al. > > Cloud seeding (principally to make rain) has had a long and highly chequered > history in the 60 years since Vonnegut, Schaefer & Langmuir did their > pioneering work. Many studies since then were contaminated by commercial > interests. There is no essentially no consensus as to whether and under what > circumstances it will work. This is especially true for clouds that contain > ice. Whether seeding will enhance, reduce or have negligible effect on such > clouds depends on: atmospheric stability, cloud-base temperature, updraught > speed, presence or absence of conditions in which natural secondary can > function, level and location etc etc. I think there is good reason to feel > sceptical of studies reporting quantitative estimates of changes induced by > seeding. My view is that - as with several geoengineering schemes - what is > urgently required is well-controlled , comprehensive field experiments. Only > then will it be possible to establish whether cloud seeding might, on a > regional scale, be important vis-a-vis climate change. > > Cheers, John. > > > ******************************** > > Quoting Neil Farbstein <[email protected]>: > >> > I'm glad we agree. Small cloud seeding experiments over Greenland >> > should be practical. We should give this some thought and modeling. >> > Can you do that at your lab? Google satellite pictures and weather >> > satellites can locate clouds that are likely targets to seed; The >> > bigger clouds in the places that are most strategic. >> > An international organization or groups of industrialized nations can >> > pay the local residents or the greenland government subsidies for >> > participating in the cloud seeding program. >> > >> > On Dec 15, 8:27 pm, Andrew Lockley <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >> For clarity, the main reason my for suggesting cloud seeding is that it >>> can >>> >> be used to build up greenland to a height where the air temperature is >>> low >>> >> enough to sustain the ice sheet. The could potentially reverse the >>> >> catastrophic Greenland tipping point - which will unleash several metres of >>> >> sea level rise over a few hundred years. Game over for London, Venice, >>> >> Florida, New York, etc. if that happens. Worth a bit of jet fuel or a >>> few >>> >> rockets to prevent that, I'd argue. >>> >> >>> >> A >>> >> >>> >> 2009/12/15 Neil Farbstein <[email protected]> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>>> >> > I suggested the same cloud seeding strategy a month ago. Somebody >>>> >> > authoritative said that the biggest snowfall recorded over the >>>> >> > alaskan arctic caused the biggest melt water recorded during the >>>> >> > spring. That's anecdotal evidence but I dropped the idea of working on >>>> >> > that anyway. >>> >> >>>> >> > There wont be a melt water problem if clouds are seeded over large >>>> >> > parts of the gulfstream to cool it and the winds that blow off it. >>> >> >>>> >> > On Dec 15, 5:47 am, Andrew Lockley <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>> >> > > I note the use of cloud seeding by the Chinese, and its >>> >> unexpected effect >>>> >> > in >>>>> >> > > causing huge snowfalls in Beijing. It seems that there may be >>> >> two useful >>>>> >> > > geoengineering approaches with this technique, and I'd be >>>>> interested in >>>>> >> > > hearing comments. >>> >> >>>>> >> > > 1) Rebuild ice - by inducing snowfalls over Greenland, >>> >> Antarctica and the >>>>> >> > > Arctic, it would perhaps be possible to maintain ice. In >>>>> Greenland, >>>> >> > where >>>>> >> > > the height of the ice cap is critical, this would seem a >>>>> particularly >>>>> >> > > appealing prospect. >>>>> >> > > 2) Albedo modification - Fresh snow is whiter than old snow, >>>>> especially >>>> >> > in >>>>> >> > > polluted areas. Is the albedo change worth pursuing? My guess is not. >>>>> >> > > HOWEVER, I suspect that triggering significant autumn and spring >>>> >> > snowfalls >>>>> >> > > in permafrost regions, we could potentially significantly modify >>>>> albedo. >>> >> >>>>> >> > > I invite comments. >>> >> >>>>> >> > > A >>> >> >>>> >> > -- >>> >> >>>> >> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups >>>> >> > "geoengineering" group. >>>> >> > To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. >>>> >> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>> >> > >>> >> >>> [email protected]<geoengineering%2bunsubscr...@go >>> oglegroups.com> >>>> >> > . >>>> >> > For more options, visit this group at >>>> >> >http://groups.google.com/group/geoengineering?hl=en.- Hide quoted text - >>> >> >>> >> - Show quoted text - >> > >> > -- >> > >> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >> > Groups "geoengineering" group. >> > To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. >> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> > [email protected]. >> > For more options, visit this group at >> > http://groups.google.com/group/geoengineering?hl=en. >> > >> > >> > > > > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "geoengineering" group. 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