There is a pleasing simplicity to answering a question as if it were a binary, but I suppose if you got these people in a room and spoke with them quietly, the question could not be answered with a yes or no, but rather with an expression of what kind and how much.
If we take a portfolio view, the question is how large and what type of investment should we be making in solar geoengineering research. I suspect that even Al Gore and Ray Pierrehumbert would favor some climate modeling, strategic analyses, etc. 'Small and limited' is not as catchy 'they're just crazy' as a rhetorical device. Sometimes the will to entertain supercedes the need to make a nuanced point. On Saturday, August 24, 2013, Simon Driscoll wrote: > Salif, > > my belief is that he suggests other avenues are far more sensible and that > this avenue isn't one to seek a solution from, hence his: "We shouldn’t > waste a lot of time talking about them. Some people will anyway, but > they’re just crazy." Admittedly, it's quite full on, albeit similar > sentiments have been echoed before by some of the world's most prominent > scientists/policy researchers etc., e.g.: > "In delivering the prestigious Tyndall Lecture at the annual American > Geophysical Union meeting last December, he said the idea of putting > sulfate aerosols in the stratosphere was “barking mad.” Pierrehumbert also > rejects the value of doing field experiments. “The whole idea of > geoengineering is so crazy and would lead to such bad consequences, it > really is pretty pointless. We already know enough about sulfate albedo > engineering to know it would put the world in a really precarious state. > Field experiments are really a dangerous step on the way to deployment, and > I have a lot of doubts what would actually be learned.”" > > It seems that Tim Palmer holds the belief that impressions will change a > lot when models become better (although he doesn't use a comparable tone): > "the > nations of the world should come together to fund the sort of > supercomputers that would allow us to simulate the climate of the coming > century with much greater reliability than is currently possible. The > impact that this will have for mitigation, adaptation and geoengineering > policies is likely to be enormous.", and so on. > > Al Gore does discuss other things he think may bring about solutions > though - just not involving SRM in any way. > > And anyway, it seems quite obvious that there exists no necessary > condition for a statement involving the pointing out of what an individual > considers to be a major obvious issue/flaw to be coupled with a solution, > no? > > Simon > > ________________________________________________ > > Simon Driscoll > Atmospheric, Oceanic and Planetary Physics > Department of Physics > University of Oxford > > Office: +44 (0) 1865 272930 > Mobile: +44 (0) 7935314940 > > http://www2.physics.ox.ac.uk/contacts/people/driscoll > ------------------------------ > *From:* Salif KONE [[email protected] <javascript:_e({}, 'cvml', > '[email protected]');>] > *Sent:* 24 August 2013 15:19 > *To:* Simon Driscoll; [email protected] <javascript:_e({}, > 'cvml', '[email protected]');> > *Subject:* Re: [geo] Al Gore on geoengineering > > I do disagree with this Al Gore' statement " ...We shouldn’t waste a > lot of time talking about them. Some people will anyway, but they’re just > crazy.". He exposes the problems without proposing a solution; > Geo-engineering is trying to find a solutin through techniques as SRM... > > **************************************************** > *Salif KONE, * > M.Sc.Université Joseph Fourier/OSUG Grenoble/ > UniversitéMontpellier II, 2007. > *Enseignant* à l’Ecole Nationale d’Ingénieurs > Abderrhamane Baba Touré (ENI-ABT) > Adresse: 410 Av. Van Vollenhoven BP.: 242, Bamako-Mali. > *PhD Student*(Oct. 2011- present), ISFRA-Bamako. > Tel.:+223 76 39 60 09 / +223 64 59 67 99 > BP.:7048, Bamako-Mali. > Email:[email protected] <javascript:_e({}, 'cvml', > 'email%[email protected]');> > > ------------------------------ > *De :* Simon Driscoll <[email protected] <javascript:_e({}, 'cvml', > '[email protected]');>> > *À :* "[email protected] <javascript:_e({}, 'cvml', > '[email protected]');>" > <[email protected]<javascript:_e({}, 'cvml', > '[email protected]');>> > > *Envoyé le :* Vendredi 23 août 2013 21h20 > *Objet :* [geo] Al Gore on geoengineering > > Al Gore: "Let me deal with the geoengineering part of your question > first. That’s complex because there are some benign geoengineering > proposals like white roofs or efforts to figure out a way to extract CO2 > from the atmosphere , though no one has figured out how to do that yet. But > the geoengineering options most often discussed, like putting sulfur > dioxide into the atmosphere or orbiting tinfoil strips — these are simply > nuts. We shouldn’t waste a lot of time talking about them. Some people will > anyway, but they’re just crazy. > > To the broader part of your question, innovation is already playing a > major role in bringing about new potential solutions to the climate crisis. > The tech world had a bitter experience after the burst of enthusiasm in > 2005 and 2006 because of a perfect storm made up of four elements: First, > the great recession, which had a huge, destructive impact on business > generally. Number two, the Chinese juggernaut, which subsidized the > production of several prominent renewable energy technologies to the point > where their sales price fell below the price of production in the West. > Third, the shale gas boom dropped the retail price of electricity to levels > below what many renewable energy plans needed to be viable. And fourth > there was the policy failure I mentioned earlier in the U.S. Senate and > Copenhagen. And all the while there was this massively funded climate > denier campaign by the Koch Brothers and Exxon-Mobile and others that hired > tobacco industry veterans to work with them on consumer advertising and > lobbying activities. > But that setback was only temporary because reality has a way of > reasserting itself. There has been a 100-fold increase in the number of > extreme, high-temperature events around the world in the distribution > curve. And people have noticed for themselves — the rain storms are bigger, > the droughts are deeper and the fires are more destructive. All of these > things have not escaped notice and people are connecting the dots. The > cumulative amount of energy trapped by manmade global warming pollution > each day in the earth’s atmosphere is now equal to the energy that would be > released by 400,000 Hiroshima bombs going off every 24 hours. It’s a big > planet, but that’s a lot of energy. > The consequences are now hard to escape. Every night on the news, it’s > like a nature hike through the book of revelations. Eleven states today are > fighting 35 major fires! People are noticing this. And simultaneously > they’re noticing the sharp drop in the cost of carbon-free, greenhouse > gas-free energy, and the combination is pushing us over this political > tipping point and the trend is unstoppable." > > http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2013/08/21/ > al-gore-explains-why-hes-optimistic-about-stopping-global-warming/ > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "geoengineering" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected] <javascript:_e({}, > 'cvml', 'geoengineering%[email protected]');>. > To post to this group, send email to > [email protected]<javascript:_e({}, 'cvml', > '[email protected]');> > . > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/geoengineering. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > -- _______________ Ken Caldeira Carnegie Institution for Science Dept of Global Ecology 260 Panama Street, Stanford, CA 94305 USA +1 650 704 7212 [email protected] http://dge.stanford.edu/labs/caldeiralab @kencaldeira Assistant: Sharyn Nantuna, [email protected] -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "geoengineering" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/geoengineering. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
