Hi again, Sorry I forgot to send the mail from yesterday to the users list - I will correct that in a moment.
So here is my notes from the second big meeting we had last night, which covers the upcoming release schedule, things which are considered blockers to 2.0 pre-releases, and how we plan to get 2.0 out the door. As usual, feedback is welcome. Happy GIMPing, Dave. The Second Big Serious Meeting ----------------------------- 8 Aug 03, around 8pm Discussion was led by Daniel Rogers (dsrogers) but stuff said is for the most part anonymous. Partly because there shouldn't be any ad hominem attacks that way, and partly because I didn't take down any names. Present: Dan Rogers, Raphael Quinet, Dave Neary (bolsh), Sven Neumann, Mitch Natterer, Hans Brix Anderssen (brix), Jakub Steiner (jimmac), Simon Budig (nomis), Marc Lehmann, Ville Patsi (drc), Oyvind Kolas (pippin), Calvin Williamson, Roman Joss (romanofski), Maurits Rijk, Branko Collins (bbc). Topic discussion, in approximate chronological order: ----------------------------------------------------- - Features required for 2.0 - Documentation and web - Roadmap - Near-term release schedule - Bugs - GIMP Foundation - Release manager - Features required for 2.0 --------------------------- There was quite a lot of talk on what was required for a 2.0 release. It was agreed that a pre-release should have feature complete versions of everything going into 2.0, for obvious reasons. These can be somewhat buggy, but they should at least support what is supported in the 1.2 equivalents. The major features or API changes which it was agreed are necessary are: 1) Complete path tool (nomis) 2) Remove libgck (Sven & mitch) 3) Finish the text tool (Sven) 4) Documentation (more on this later) 5) Web-site (again, more on this later) 6) Some libgimp changes which need to be made now so that we can have binary compatibility across a 2.2 release - Documentation --------------- We felt that with pre-releases, the documentation will become more complete. There should, however, be an effort to actively get people writing docs. The main requirement, then, for 2.0 pre-releases will be to have a working help framework, so that when people hit F1 for help, they at least get a message saying "This help item does not exist yet. If you would like to help write it, contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]" or some such. If documentation is going to be released as a separate package, as now seems likely, then we will need to define the interface between the core and the help pages reasonably quickly. The general idea is to more or less hard-code tagnames for a particular help topic, and get the core and help using the same tags, and agreeing on how they be communicated. This will presumably require a considerable amount of communication with the help team. We also need to have the docs browsable online so that if people want to browse them they can. - Web-site ---------- The new site should switch over to www.gimp.org soon. There will obviously be quite a bit of pain involved as content gets added and we get lots of "your website sucks" type feedback, but this will only be for the short term. We should switch to mmaybe as the main site before 2.0pre1. It was suggested to do it even earlier than that, in the region of 2 to 3 weeks time. It was also discussed whether it was a good idea to have a separate coordinator for the website. - Roadmap --------- As an approximate set of ideals, it was agreed that we want this: 2.0pre1 very soon, 2.0 soon, 2.2 next year, and gegl integration the end of next Summer. More specifically, the near-term release schedule that we agreed was reasonable is this: 1 or 2 developer releases(one now, more or less, and another one in another 2 weeks). 6 weeks time (end of September 2003): First pre-release of 2.0, including the features mentioned above, and any other minor features that people code in the meantime (hint, hint). Roughly 3 months later: 2.0 It was more or less agreed that 3 to 4 weeks was a nice turnaround time for pre-releases, so that would imply between 4 and 6 (inclusive) pre-releases before 2.0. The reason for not having a pre-release straight away was mentioned above: to be feature complete, some features need a little more than 2 weeks work, and people have real lives. So 6 weeks was felt to be a reasonable amount of time to have the path tool and the help browser in place. - Bugs ------ The developer release will also be a prelude to a bug week. We would like people (that's you, in particular) to actively work on bugzilla clean-up for 2.0 - bugs need to be prioritized, unconfirmed bugs need confirming and milestoning (and if you're feeling really helpful, fixing). The idea would more or less be that the 2.0 milestone will be locked down for anything other than serious bugs after this bug week, so if there are bugs that are annoying you a lot, this is your chance to get them considered and worked on for the 2.0 releases. Just to spell that out - at the end of the bug week, any bugs reported against the gimp in CVS will be milestoned for 2.0.x, or even 2.2, unless they are considered blockers for the release. If we want to get a 2.0 release soon, we need to get lots of testing done, and lots of bug fixing done, but we also need to choose what to do and what not to do. We felt this was a reasonable compromise. It was also re-discussed whether it would make sense to have module owners. The conclusion was that for certain components, it makes sense to have a smaller group of people getting the bug reports and having responsibility for them. This would be done via mail aliases for the group of people guiding the component, in a similar way to that which is used for (say) gtktreeview in gtk+. The module owner group wouldn't have to be technical, and we should be actively recruiting people to do this kind of work and leave more time for programmers to program. This leads us on to... - Task list ----------- There are lots of non-technical jobs that need doing around the gimp - docs, website, bugzilla triage, internationalisation, etc. Often it is quite difficult to know what needs doing, and who to contact about getting it done. We need a list of bite-sized tasks that people can do, including the kinds of tasks that only take a few hours a week to do, but are ongoing tasks. We used to have a TODO, and we could use that system again, if someone were maintaining it. That could come under the remit of the release manager to some extent, but since the mainenance of the TODO list is mostly a non-technical task, anyone could do it (in fact, as an example of a task, "Maintaining the TODO list" would go in the TODO list). We might do this through Bugzilla using a keyword to allow getting at the list easily, which would imply getting more people looking at bugzilla regularly. Then again, if there were a link to a bugzilla query on the webpage marked "GIMP TODO list" we could get that for free. - GIMP Foundation ------------------ Basically, we're agreed this is a good idea to have some kind of public face people and companies can contribute to. There is no problem with having 2 foundations, one in Europe and one in the US. It was more or less agreed taht assigning copyright to the foundation isn't going to happen soon (for a start, so many plug-in authors have gone their merry way and are almost unfindable) This may hapen in the future, but most people felt that it would not be something they'd be happy doing personally. Other people said they would prefer to assign copyright to an organism under the jurisdiction of European law rather than under US jurisdiction. So, to sum up, there's no reason not to have one of these. Daniel Rogers has agreed to do the necessary paperwork and set up the foundation and the bank account for donations in the US. Pretty quickly after getting that up and going, we will need to get a board of directors and a set of by-laws. We know lots of people who can help with this (in particular, the GNOME foundation and the FSF). If someone wants to set up an equivalent in Europe, we're all ears. Currently no-one has said they'll do it, so it's an open point. To start, the foundation will only be a board an a bank account - in the future, we could expand its responsibilities to promotional work, a single point where people could go to get speakers, a group that does press releases and so on. It was agreed that at least in the short term it is undesirable to have the foundation have actual control of source code, just in case the foundation then gets sued. In brief, it's being set up with a very narrow remit, with the possibility to expand later if it is felt that there is a need. - Release manager ----------------- The responsibilities are: - Follow CVS so that he can write release notes, and knows at any given time who is working on what, and at what stage it is. - Follow bugzilla closely - Make releases regularly, according to the roadmap (or make sure releases get made) - Update the roadmap to reflect reality - Write release notes for the releases (keep NEWS up to date) - Generally annoy people sending mails to the mailing lists and sending content to the website to explain the state of play and get people to work on stuff. Dave Neary (me) agreed to do this. He already regrets it. That's it folks - today, Sven and mitch are going to talk to us about the major changes in the codebase and the general utility stuff which exists now which has been written from scratch, Calvin and Daniel are going to talk about gegl and how we can use it, and work towards having a gegl that we can use in a year. I'm going to lead a discussion on communication in the gimp, and how to maybe make it easier for people to contribute, and jimmac is going to demonstrate what a power user really is. Goodbye from everyone at camp. As usual, comments are welcome on all this stuff. While on a philosophical level, we are agreed on the direction things should take, all the details are open to discussion, if there's any reason to change them. Cheers, Dave. -- Dave Neary Lyon, France _______________________________________________ Gimp-developer mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.xcf.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer