########################################################################## # If Goanet stops reaching you, contact [EMAIL PROTECTED] # # Want to check the archives? http://www.goanet.org/pipermail/goanet/ # # Please keep your discussion/tone polite, to reflect respect to others # ##########################################################################
Bosco, You are obviously a gentleman and a scholar because you have responded to some very emotional, hostile and one sided comments with a pretty balanced exposition of the Palestinian problem. Partitions of countries, by definition, will be fair or unfair depending on how one is affected. My own comparative analysis starts with the UN approved events of 1947 where one partition was accepted on the Indian sub-continent and after some transitional chaos, everyone moved on, but the other has never been accepted by the Arabs, to this day. Not only that, the Arabs tried to impose their will by force in 1948, rather than follow the Gandhian way of civil disobedience and negotiations, and their militants are still trying to impose their will by force. I believe that going beyond 1947 in Palestine to how everyone got there and in what proportions, is akin to arguing about how the Hindus and Muslims got to India and why that partition was necessary. To me, the ancient history became moot after 1947, other than for those who want to inject emotion into the debate, and does not contribute to any rational solution. Mr. Correia-Afonso seems to believe the fiction that all the Israelis came from Europe. The fact is that while many of them did come from Europe after having survived the Nazi genocide, we know that native Jews have been there since the time of Abraham. The critics curiously ignore the Holocaust in Europe perpetrated by the Nazis, and how this led the world community to the conclusion that the Jews needed a state of their own, and they situated that state in a bleak and barren desert area where Jews and Muslims had co-existed since Biblical times. The critics of Israel also ignore the committment by the US and Israel, made in 2000 by Bill Clinton and Ehud Barak, to a 2 state solution, with all issues to be negotiated once hostilities cease. Yasser Arafat participated in the negotiations but walked away from the table and re-ignited the intifadah after Ariel Sharon visited the Temple Mount. They could have protested with non-violent marches, but chose to resume the violence and suicide bombings of innocent Israeli citizens. I am very sympathetic to the plight of the Palestinians because I have several friends and business clients among them, and have actually helped them raise funds to provide computers for the kids in the camps. However, I see no hope for them as long as they reject Israel's right to exist in peace and security. I am pessimistic that they will for several reasons: a) Events are being controlled not by Palestinians who want peace but by their militants who are willing to kill anyone who wants peace with Israel. b) They have refused to change their charter to reflect their acceptance of Israel c) All their official maps of the region show no state of Israel d) Their textbooks teach the most virulent hatred of the Jews, calling them monkeys and pigs e) Just last week their militants tried to kill Mohammad Abbas, Arafat's interim successor, just because he asked for a cessation of hostilities against Israel so that dialog could resume While "occupation is an occupation" sounds logical it is also simplistic and misleading and changes meaning completely when one realizes that it came about by virtue of a defense against an attack and an attempt by the Palestinians to eliminate the whole state of Israel since 1947-48. I'm am glad to see that you picked up on the fiction that the "squalid" camps in Palestine are like Soweto, which is a classic example of the injection of emotion into the debate. While Soweto is squalid it is far better that a typical Dharavi-type jhopdi settlement in India, but the Palestinian camps are of "pukka" construction and are no worse that any middle-income neighborhood in any Indian city. Mr. Correia-Afonso, while alleging that the poor Palestinians live in squalid camps, then turns around and seems quite sanguine about Suha Arafat's negotiated deal to be paid US$22 million a year just to disclose where the billion or so that her husband stole from those same Palestinians was hidden. He asks what business this is of the Americans, seemingly oblivious to the fact that more funds for the Palestinians comes from the US than any other country, including the rich Arab states. Then Mr. Correia-Afonso triumphantly throws in what he considers his trump card, the classic red herring of the no-bid contracts for Halliburton and the gratuitious comment that Dick Cheney used to be the CEO of Halliburton. The facts are as follows: a) Halliburton is a world leader in oilfield supplies and engineering, so, at the very least, the work they were hired to do will be done b) No-bid contracts for Halliburton started in Bill Clinton's administration, before George Bush became President, and Dick Cheney became Vice-President c) Any alleged wrongdoing regarding Halliburton has and is being investigated in open legal proceedings, and they will receive just legal punishment if this is warranted. Will the Suha Arafat deal be investigated by anyone? d) The red-herring that Dick Cheney had anything to do with these no-bid contracts has been investigated and detailed on www.factcheck.org an independant, non-partisan investigative web site that has checked and opined on charges by both Republicans and Democrats. --- Bosco D'Mello <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > ########################################################################## > # If Goanet stops reaching you, contact > [EMAIL PROTECTED] # > # Want to check the archives? > http://www.goanet.org/pipermail/goanet/ # > # Please keep your discussion/tone polite, to > reflect respect to others # > ########################################################################## > > Why did India (Goa) declare 3 days of mourning on > Mr. Arafat's passing?? > > Is it only because we have a Congress-led government > at the center and Mr. > Arafat was present for Mrs. Gandhi's funeral ?? > > Does India regularly declare mourning when world > leaders pass away ?? > > I think we can debate the Israeli-Palestinian > conflict till we're blue in the > face. As Tariq rightly says an "Occupation is > Occupation"......on the flipside > history tells us the Israelis were at war for more > than a year in 1948 to create > the state of Israel. The Israelis will never give up > an inch of land when they > fought long and hard to obtain it. Many of Israel's > present day political > leaders have fought in it's many wars, including > Nobel Laureate (Peace) Yitzhak > Rabin. The Jews always had the upperhand from the > get-go after the Holocaust > albeit they were buying land from the Palestinians > long before 1948 similar to > how non-Goans are buying vast tracts of land in Goa. > > Nevertheless viewing the Palestinians living in > ghettoized environments is > reminiscent of Soweto....only here it is more > concrete than corrugated metal. I > hope the community of nations and the people > involved on both sides will come > together to alleviate the conditions of the > Palestinians while at the same time > safeguarding the habitants of Israel. > > Mr. Correia-Afonso's comparisons of Arafat with > other luminary figures of > history is misplaced. Would he consider the > mujahedin (LeT) in Kashmir as heroes > ?? Would he consider the proponents of an armed > assault to extricate Goa from > India as heroes ?? > > Mr. Correia-Afonso says "Let us not put a label on > people on the basis of our > own pre-conceived notions or, what is worse, on > notions conceived for us by > vested interests. Let history be the judge of who is > a hero and who is a > terrorist." > > RESPONSE: Exactly !! You are giving us your > pre-conceived notion too !! There's > plenty of reading matter available - > "Israeli/American", European, Arab, Muslim, > Jewish, left-wing, right-wing, shock-jock, etc. that > helps us make an opinion. > > The original poster, "Comet", had his opinion - > Arafat was a terrorist besides > being a jet-setting, city-hopping, gun-toting, > wheeling-dealing, etc. etc. > etc...!! > > Why the holiday ?? Holidays have economic > consequences !! > > Best wishes - Bosco > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Goanet - http://www.goanet.org - Goa's premier > mailing list is 10 years old > >
