Is that another "wave" I see on the horizon ... On Fri, Dec 3, 2010 at 1:01 PM, Ikai Lan (Google) <ikai.l+gro...@google.com<ikai.l%2bgro...@google.com> > wrote:
> That's a problem of your own creation. A multitude of choice is one of the > benefits of any Java platform. For instance, you mention that Objectify > seems great but may not be supported 1-2 years down the line. This is an > argument that you can apply to just about any open source library or > framework in existence. Even paid tools, for instance, can be deprecated. > You're eager optimizing your support problem, when really the problem you > should be solving is "what do I need to build? How do I get there?" > > In a previous life, I made the mistake of worrying about this with regards > to using jQuery (silly, right?) and the Google Charts API. Instead, I built > what is quite possibly one of the worst Javascript frameworks ever, and the > project shipped late. I should have focused on the project, not phantom > concerns about ongoing support for open source code. > > > -- > Ikai Lan > Developer Programs Engineer, Google App Engine > Blogger: http://googleappengine.blogspot.com > Reddit: http://www.reddit.com/r/appengine > Twitter: http://twitter.com/app_engine > > > > On Fri, Dec 3, 2010 at 12:50 PM, George Moschovitis < > george.moschovi...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> It 's counter productive for me, for the simple reason that I cannot >> choose which API to >> use: >> >> - JPA seems to be the standard but it's geared towards RDBMS >> - JDO is 'older' but better supports non relational DBs >> - Both of the above seem abandoned (for example they use a very old >> Datanucleus version) >> - the Low level is too ..low level with no support of static typing >> (one of the benefits of using Java) >> - Twig has interesting features but seems to lack momentum >> - Objectify seems to have more momentum, but is not standard, dunno if >> this will be supported in a year or two >> - etc, etc..." >> >> As you can see I am on a deadlock, I cannot decide which API to use >> and frankly all of the available options leave a lot >> to be desired. >> >> New features like (Channel API, Reserved instances, etc) may be cool, >> but really GAE/J needs a solid, dependable database story... >> >> just my 2 cents... >> -g. >> >> >> On Dec 3, 8:46 pm, "Ikai Lan (Google)" >> <ikai.l+gro...@google.com<ikai.l%2bgro...@google.com> >> > >> wrote: >> > We'll investigate ways to keep JDO/JPA up to date. >> > >> > I disagree about the fact that having community driven libraries is >> counter >> > productive. In fact, this is a sign of a thriving community. When >> evaluating >> > our support of these libraries, we realized that we could have done a >> better >> > job helping the folks building great tools for App Engine users. We've >> taken >> > steps to better involve framework and library developers, and going >> forward, >> > we will be having higher expectations for our own involvement helping >> these >> > developers be successful. >> > >> > -- >> > Ikai Lan >> > Developer Programs Engineer, Google App Engine >> > Blogger:http://googleappengine.blogspot.com >> > Reddit:http://www.reddit.com/r/appengine >> > Twitter:http://twitter.com/app_engine >> > >> > On Fri, Dec 3, 2010 at 10:37 AM, George Moschovitis < >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > george.moschovi...@gmail.com> wrote: >> > > > We haven't abandoned JDO/JPA, but we may emphasize the low-level >> APIs >> > > going >> > > > forward. You'll always get low-level features first. The mismatch >> between >> > > > datastore features and relational database features is starting to >> really >> > > > grow. >> > >> > > I understand that emphasizing on the Low Level API makes sense, but >> > > some work on JDO/JPA would be reasonable. >> > > There is a lot of stuff that could be implemented on top of the >> > > standard APIs. >> > >> > > Moreover, you could consider offering a custom Higher Level API, maybe >> > > something similar to the Python version. >> > > Having 10 slightly different community driven APIs is not productive. >> > >> > > regards, >> > > -g. >> > >> > > > One thing we'll plan on doing is to work more closely with framework >> and >> > > > library implementors to make sure they have what they need to build >> > > toolkits >> > > > that better mesh with non-relational datastores. For instance, take >> a >> > > look >> > > > at our recent article about Django: >> > >> > > >http://code.google.com/appengine/articles/django-nonrel.html >> > >> > > > (BTW, if you are a Python developer, please do not use >> app-engine-patch. >> > > > It's deprecated). >> > >> > > > The original approach we took and encouraged was to bend existing >> > > toolkits >> > > > to work with GAE to adhere to standards. We'll still do this when >> > > possible, >> > > > but we're more pragmatic than dogmatic about standards. In some >> cases, >> > > such >> > > > as the datastore, it may make more sense for us to help developers >> build >> > > > toolkits that can keep up with the trend of non-relational >> persistence. >> > >> > > > -- >> > > > Ikai Lan >> > > > Developer Programs Engineer, Google App Engine >> > > > Blogger:http://googleappengine.blogspot.com >> > > > Reddit:http://www.reddit.com/r/appengine >> > > > Twitter:http://twitter.com/app_engine >> > >> > > > On Thu, Nov 25, 2010 at 12:38 AM, Eugene D <edanil...@gmail.com> >> wrote: >> > > > > Great question. It would be very helpful to get a status report on >> > > > > this as well as a roadmap for either this library or any planned >> > > > > alternatives >> > >> > > > > On Nov 23, 3:48 pm, George Moschovitis < >> george.moschovi...@gmail.com> >> > > > > wrote: >> > > > > > Are there any plans to resume work on datanucleus-appengine? >> > >> > > > > > The progress on this lib seems to have stopped 6 months ago and >> there >> > > > > > still a lot of related issues in the tracker: >> > >> > > > > > update to the latest version of datanucleus, support for unowned >> > > > > > relations, support for more jdo/jpa features, jpa docs and >> more... >> > >> > > > > > is there a roadmap for this important library? >> > >> > > > > > thanks, >> > > > > > -g. >> > >> > > > > -- >> > > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >> > > Groups >> > > > > "Google App Engine for Java" group. >> > > > > To post to this group, send email to >> > > > > google-appengine-j...@googlegroups.com. >> > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> > > > > google-appengine-java+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com<google-appengine-java%2bunsubscr...@googlegroups.com><google-appengine-java%2B >> unsubscr...@googlegroups.com><google-appengine-java%2B >> > > unsubscr...@googlegroups.com> >> > > > > . >> > > > > For more options, visit this group at >> > > > >http://groups.google.com/group/google-appengine-java?hl=en. >> > >> > > -- >> > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >> Groups >> > > "Google App Engine for Java" group. >> > > To post to this group, send email to >> > > google-appengine-j...@googlegroups.com. >> > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> > > google-appengine-java+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com<google-appengine-java%2bunsubscr...@googlegroups.com><google-appengine-java%2B >> unsubscr...@googlegroups.com> >> > > . >> > > For more options, visit this group at >> > >http://groups.google.com/group/google-appengine-java?hl=en. >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Google App Engine for Java" group. >> To post to this group, send email to >> google-appengine-j...@googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> google-appengine-java+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com<google-appengine-java%2bunsubscr...@googlegroups.com> >> . >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/google-appengine-java?hl=en. >> >> > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Google App Engine for Java" group. > To post to this group, send email to > google-appengine-j...@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > google-appengine-java+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com<google-appengine-java%2bunsubscr...@googlegroups.com> > . > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/google-appengine-java?hl=en. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Google App Engine for Java" group. To post to this group, send email to google-appengine-j...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to google-appengine-java+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/google-appengine-java?hl=en.
