On Sat, Aug 30, 2008 at 3:05 PM, Michael Schreifels <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Davide, > > I really don't see the Django template language being a valid concern > at all. It is just a library that Google provides, no one is forcing > you to use it.
I think for new comers to Python, it IS presented as the only choice as many people would have difficulty "monkey-patching" another template engine, as there have been issues in getting, to my knowledge at least, Mako and Genshi to fully work on appengine. It seems like this new cookbook area would be a good spot to for developers of those other templates to put their integration recipes: http://appengine-cookbook.appspot.com/ > > And further, personally I think that if you find Django templates too > limiting, you probably don't fully understand it. It is still very controversial in the Python community to not include the ability to run Python in the template. I think it is very appropriate for newcomers to question how and why something works the way it does. It is far from a foregone conclusion that Django templates are the superior way to accomplish templating in Python. I have personally observed two PHP developers turned off from wanting to use Python ever again, because they were forced to use Django templates in a project. Of course we Python programmers could say, wow your "stupid" because you don't do it my way, it is the best. On the other hand maybe they have a point. Sometimes, in my opinion too, some Python in the template is the easiest way to solve a problem. They were a bit offended that this design decision was not delegated to them, instead of forced upon them. I think it is ok, to question this decision if you are from another language. Here are links to blog entries by Shannon Behrens, a guy who wrote a Python web framework in 2001, in which he also questions the wisdom of Django templates: http://jjinux.blogspot.com/search?q=django+template I don't consider him to not understand Django templates, yet he also doesn't use them. This is really a personal decision though, as many people are happy with Django templates. To each their own. One thing I do disagree though is that if you don't like some portion of Django like templates, or the URL dispatch, you don't know how it works. I think many people know how Django works, but only like certain parts of it. I happen to really like the admin interface and the URL dispatching, and not the template or ORM. In addition, I have personally done some very large Django projects, and have some issues with doing things with the Django templates. I don't particularly care for them, and would prefer Genshi or Mako, although they aren't horrible either. One gripe I have with Google is that they need to correct their documentation here: http://code.google.com/appengine/docs/gettingstarted/usingwebapp.html It states that app engine supports: Django, CherryPy, Pylons, and web.py This is actually incorrect, as many of the components, like templates, in Pylons are not fully tested and working. Hopefully this gets addressed soon. I switched to Django > after coding with Ruby on Rails and PHP, both of which allow you to > embed code right in your templates. It was a difficult transition at > first, but the restrictions placed by the Django template language > make sense, and they encourage good programming practices of the > separation between programming logic and presentation code. > > And if you're concerned about reusing blocks of code, the concerns > about {% with %} are only relevant to Django < 1.0, and the devs have > been telling users to use SVN (which is very stable) and not 0.96 for > MONTHS now. (Yeah, AE only supports 0.96 out-of-the-box, but that > makes sense. Why would Google want to track SVN? I just have my own > checkout of Django I use. And besides, Django 1.0 is due for release > next week. I guarantee Google will support it.) And besides, I have > never had to use {% with %}. Most code repetition I come across is > more logically solved with block inheritance. > > I strongly recommend you upgrade to the latest Django beta and read > the template docs. And if it really doesn't work for you, there are > plenty of other options. > > This post is really about the problems that Google has with > communications about where App Engine is going (and WHEN). > > > On Aug 30, 4:56 am, Davide Rognoni <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> Doubts about Django >> Templatehttp://groups.google.com/group/google-appengine/browse_thread/thread/... >> >> On Aug 28, 12:09 am, javaDinosaur <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> >> > I am starting to have doubts about continuing to develop my >> > applications for GAE. My concerns are not technical although I have a >> > some anxieties about transaction data propagation performance. >> >> > My concerns center around Google's commitment to the App Engine >> > project. Compared to Amazon's Web Service forums this place feels like >> > a technical backwater. Developers hosting on Amazon AWS post >> > interesting questions and get deep-dive replies promptly from Amazon >> > staff. Amazon is releasing new Cloud development services monthly yet >> > all we get is minor patches. >> >> > Here on the GAE forum elementary questions about how GAE ticks go >> > unanswered for months. Basic roadmap type info such as will we get SSL >> > or scheduled tasks is missing. >> >> > I just feel that the GAE Team is not building up any development >> > stream in what should be the last 4 month run up to the year-end >> > release. Communication with the developer community here is abysmal >> > compared to the investment in developer relations made by companies >> > such as Microsoft, Redhat or Amazon. >> >> > What's happened to the early buzz Google? Has the top bass pinched >> > half the team to firefight problems on another project? > > > -- Noah Gift http://noahgift.com --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Google App Engine" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/google-appengine?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
