By all means stay on here Ricardo, And don't be offended by Hans. He just gets carried away sometimes.
As for a horn sitting in Bb, I have a good story. A few years back our third horn bought a Schmidt triple and was advised to have the horn sit in Bb since he would be using the high f horn more often. Well it took him an entire year to get to used to the reversed thumb valve and there were many many "funny" missed notes while he was making the adjustment. So to my story: We were doing a live Hansel and Gretel and right in the beginning the 1st valve of the first horn froze up. All of a sudden no first. No melody The third quickly passed his horn down to the first and we were treated to some loud but "very" wrong notes. The first didn't realize the Bb and f side of the horn was switched. Another change of horns: My horn... an Alex 103... went to the first... the first horn.... with the stuck valve... came to me... the third got his horn back and we finished with a bang. Except??? the last notes in the prelude is the arpeggio in the forth!! I don't remember now what fingerings I used, but I did somehow manage to play the notes "sans" first valve. Ain't playing the horn fun???? Milton Milton Kicklighter 4th Horn Buffalo Philharmonic Retired ________________________________ From: Ralph Hall <[email protected]> To: The Horn List <[email protected]> Sent: Wed, June 8, 2011 4:38:26 PM Subject: Re: [Hornlist] Interesting IHS Forum post Dear Ricardo Matosinhos, Do not unsubscribe. For my own part, I shall not apologise for any rudeness on the list - or even discuss it, because that is up to the individual, but your point of view is important and valuable. As a visitor to Portugal and entranced by Fado and the fact that I can wander with my wife through a small town at a weekend and hear, through open windows, the sounds from a well attended music school wafting through the morning air - well this is wonderful and different from the twanging electric guitars (the Portuguese guitar is beautiful!), squawking clarinets etc that one hears elsewhere. I agree with most that Hans says about horn playing but, as an Englishman living and working in Germany, I find in the North particularly, many play a double horn sitting in Bb. There was a famous televised broadcast from the Proms in London where Alan Civil played Dvorak's New World Symphony but had a misbehaving horn in the rehearsal. He had to borrow a different instrument from Paxman's but built the opposite from his own. Everything was OK until the arpeggio up to top B in the last movement - try it, inverting your thumb valve! Keep the mailings coming Ricardo - after all, this is the world wide web. Ralph R. Hall On 8 Jun 2011, at 17:14, Ricardo Matosinhos wrote: > Dear Mr. Hans Pizka, you understood wrong this topic. > First, I've posted this on the IHS forum, because I'm starting to be > a little bored of seeing people making jokes and insults on this > mailing list. > The issue was related to the nomenclature of the "T" for the thumb. > The topic was not "to play or not in F thats the question". I would > like to please ask you to avoid writing ALL CAPS, because on the > internet world this means I AM SCREAMING! > I had the care of giving some references for Joseph Pehrson on his > "Harmonic Etude"(1986) referes to the thumb as the 4th finger. > 14, 124, 4, 2 etc... and Esa-Pekka Salonen on his "Concert > Etude" (2000) uses Bb/12, F/13 Bb/3.... > My statements where very flexible and international and not "Latino" > as you said... F means the same in Germany and America and is quite > similar to al the french and al the "Latinos world" Fa. But the B is > not the same in America and Germany and for the "Latinos" system > does't mean anything. That's why I suggested to have regular numbers > for b-flat fingerings and F+numbers for the F fingerings. > To answer some questions I've made a quiz at >https://spreadsheets.google.com/a/ricardomatosinhos.com/spreadsheet/viewform?formkey=dHNlT2hDR0FCcmdnTEpWck1taHROa3c6MQ > > And until now the answers gave 45% of the people playing on a Bflat- > F horn, and 76% said they play mostly in F (for these results only > 45% were european). > Even you replied this topic without using the "T" when you said > "Same with the octave Jump F1-F2 at the beginning of Strauss op.11 > Concerto as F1- Bb1 Fingering..." > I've started to play on a horn standing on F, after two years I made > the change and I'm glad I did. It was quite easy to change as I was > on my early stages, but I think would be difficult for some one > playing for several years. I fell that it makes sence since, now > people play more and more in Bflat. Also having a horn standing on > Bflat is logical since the more keys you press, larger will be the > tube length. I do play on the both sides of the horn deppending on > intonation, technique, sound coulor, but I play more in Bflat that > in F. > I didn't enjoyed your sad comments about the "Latinos" world, I > kindly asked for an opinion on the IHS forum, I didn't offended > anyone, but your depreciative commentary did in fact offended me and > all the "Latinos", believe or not the 2nd world war is over long > time ago... > You say "Latinos" don't use the full double horn, I've recently > published a small book with all the possibilities of the full double > horn ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvcxxBNenQU ) > You said "The Problem is just, that Most Latinos are INFLEXIBLE and > UNWILLING" I'm not inflexible, ou estaria a escrever em português, > isso seria inflexível, portanto dar-me ao trabalho de escrever numa > lingua que não é a minha é por si sinónimo de flexibilidade > (translate it please from portuguese, if you want to understand my > point) > You said the latinos "think their World As Be the Universe [...] > they are Forced to translate everything according to their > [...]Language & Grammar" the portuguese movies are not translated > like in spain or france, or even brazil. > Also you said "All this refusal of the F-Side or F-Horn is the > Source of so many Intonation Problems, which could Be so over so > easy, if Players would use both Sides , F & Bb Equally, according to > the particular Intonation & Sound requirements." I use both sides of > the horn for intonation, technique and sound requirements (see my > book http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvcxxBNenQU ) > You also said "Latinos also think "Concert" ." Thats not correct, I > think in F, even if I'm playing in B-flat horn. > Since I can remember I allways known Mr. Hans Pizka, from his > Playing and his editions, I have much respect for all your work and > I didn't really expected to have such depreciative and offensive > commentary from you. > I'f this kind of mood continues on this mailing list, I will have to > sadly unsubscribe it. > > > Regards from Portugal > > Ricardo Matosinhos > > > _______________________________________________ > post: [email protected] > unsubscribe or set options at >https://pegasus.memphis.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/options/horn/ralph%40brasshausmusic.com > Ralph R. Hall [email protected] Ralph R. Hall http://www.brasshausmusic.com _______________________________________________ post: [email protected] unsubscribe or set options at https://pegasus.memphis.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/options/horn/kicklighgter%40yahoo.com _______________________________________________ post: [email protected] unsubscribe or set options at https://pegasus.memphis.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
