On 28/03/2016 10:35 PM, Rick Troth wrote:
Wow ... you started a hot topic, Steve. Fun stuff!
On 03/26/16 11:59, Steve Beaver wrote:
First of all I am first and foremost an zOS Systems programmer that only
writes in HLASM and REXX as needed.
My goal is to learn Linux and then develop in Linux and then as
needed port
it to zSeries box. ...
Two popular flavors of REXX: Regina and OORexx. I use *Regina*. It is
a sibling to THE (The Hessling Editor), which is as close to ISPF as
you're likely to get. (Personally more of a fan of XEDIT, and have a
compatible THE/XEDIT profile.) But REXX on Linux or any Unix or on
Windows is a lot different from REXX on TSO or MVS or CMS.
Some people are really fond of IDEs. You might have a hard time
finding an IDE in Linux land that gives you a full ISPF feel. Like Tom
said, use the editor of your choice, use the compiler, and use 'make'.
GCC is most well known. David Crayford mentioned 'clang' which is
pretty slick and gaining in popularity, but not as broadly ported yet.
(There's also Dignus Systems C, but might not serve what it sounds
like you're looking for.) Where possible, "compilers are compilers";
avoid compiler features which lock you in. And don't get me started
about source code manglers. Keep it simple. No matter what I or anyone
else on this list tells you: KEEP IT SIMPLE.
Slickedit has full ISPF emulation mode and runs on Linux. It's not free
though! The standard version is $149, professional is $299. That's a big
ask when you've got some very good free programmers editors out there.
Githubs Atom is the most popular with the hipster hackers in our office.
I had a look
and it ticks all the boxes and today's kids like scripting in JavaScript.
- I am going to build a 64 Bit a box with 16 gig of memory and 8
Tb of
Storage and a DVD/RW. That is the easy
Part.
Does anyone have any input on which version of Linux to purchase? I
Know
SUSE has an enterprise 64 bit product?
So maybe you *do* have a bit of interest in Linux as a desktop system.
Cool!
Having started with Slackware and then bounced between SUSE and
RedHat, I'm using *OpenSUSE* heavily these days. (TL;DR) Devuan
(that's not a typo) also has substantial value. And I must mention
CentOS, even though it is a decendent of Redhat (now even fallen under
RH umbrella). CentOS is quite popular in the enterprise.
I don't run Linux on the desktop anymore. I used to use Ubuntu on my
home system but moved to a Macbook Air which gives me a platform to
develop for all the platforms I'm interested in. With brew I have an
identical toolkit to Linux for server side programming, Android Studio
and of course xcode for Apple devices.
I run headless Linux VMs under VirtualBox and file system sharing allows
me to use my favorite edit, Slickedit, on the host side. It's a great
setup and I'm very happy with it. The distros are CentOS, Ubuntu Server
and openSUSE.
I certainly don't want to start a flame war but the OS X Yosemite UI is
on a completely different level to any Linux GUI I've ever used :). TBH,
Windows 10 isn't too bad either although I much prefer *nix systems. I
use Windows at work and have exactly the same setup with VirtualBox etc.
Most Linux distros strongly support either GNOME or KDE. I find both
of those unbearably "heavy" and have been using XFCE for several
years. Heh ... then just last week I learned that *XFCE* is less
encumbered by SystemD. (oooooopppsss... now I've gone and opened
*that* can-o-worms!) Seriously, XFCE is lighter than the other two,
and there are yet more window managers and desktop environments to
choose from. Pick one and run with it, and know that it has little to
do with your distro selection, per se.
My present desktop system is a decent home brew that I inherited from
my son. He gave it up for a laptop for college and I needed a
workstation. With OpenSUSE I get *KVM* and can run any X86 guest I
need: Windows, Linux, FreeBSD, OpenBSD, NetBSD, Minix. (Even tried
Plan 9 but didn't have time enough to run out that runway.) Sorry to
stray a bit, seeing as how you didn't ask for virtualization.
Yes, Mark Post *is* being objective.
Can anyone suggest an Editor besides VI, and which language to
develop in on
a Linux Platform?
In the Unix world, the religious war continues between the VI crowd
and the EMACS crowd. Historically, VI established the first beachhead.
Just sayin. I don't really care for either, but was told "learn VI"
years ago, so I did, and that minimal knowledge has served me well.
I make a point to have *THE* on hand, though I find that I more often
use Pico because it's quick. (The replacement for Pico is *Nano*,
another GNU-ism but works.)
I see that Java was mentioned. I have it on good authority "nobody
does Java on z/OS".
One of our directors met customers in Germany recently, big banks etc.
They were big users of WAS and obviously Java. Their system was made up
mainly of zIIPs. In my experience you don't need too many Java
workloads to max out a zIIP!
Not meaning to start a flame war: yes it works, yes some people use
it, yes in production, but the guy who said that was simply stating
what he sees with his own customers. Perl works too. I would be
interested to learn if Python has been ported to z/OS. Python is the
new hotness in the Linux world. (For varying values of "new".)
Perl is a terribly designed programming language. Almost as bad as PHP!
Rocket have ported Python to z/OS. It looks very much like a 2.7 update
of Jean-Yves Mengnat's old 2.4 port. Unfortunately, it's half baked.
It's an EBCDIC port but none of the networking libraries have been
patched so don't expect to be able to use HTTP. The JSON stuff is also
broken as it doesn't handle Unicode escaping properly. A real Python
port would also patch the loader to load code from traditional PDS(E)
data sets so it's useful outside of the z/OS Unix environment. Most of
the guys on the floor here want to run scripts from the TSO command line
not a Unix shell. My Lua for z/OS port http://lua4z.com/ is complete, runs
native from PDS, has patched networking code and supports all types of
file systems on z/OS, including VSAM. It's also blisteringly fast. I
think we're going to open source it soon on Github. Rocket should open
source their Python port so others in the z/OS community interested in a
working Python for z/OS can contribute patches.
/Summary/: for editors, _learn VI_, but also learn Pico/Nano. And know
that THE is available. (Someone will probably chime in that they have
THE macros to make it work somewhat like ISPF.)
/Summary/: for languages, _learn C_. Also learn Perl. (It runs on USS
for those who care.) And know that REXX is available with the caveats
that REXX on Linux will not have the system services of MVS or CMS.
And I see that David Craig gave me a nice shout out w/r/t NORD. (Thank
you, sir.) More on that later.
-- R; <><
PS
On 03/26/16 14:45, Tom Marchant wrote:
First of all, it is GNU/Linux.
That is, it is the GNU operating system with a Linux kernel.
Seehttp://www.gnu.org/gnu/linux-and-gnu.html
It is a distinction that many ignore and many others are tired of
hearing, ...
Including moi. Stop it. It's religious.
Stallman's Free Software Foundation is a pillar in the FLOSS world.
But if the freedom they have fought for means anything, then other
groups also should get credit. So the real name of the system would be
Linux/GNU/*BSD/SourceForce/github/IBM/HPE/Oracle/onandonandonandon.
Stallman's insistence on snagging credit for Linux runs counter to his
supposed altruism.
-- R; <><
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