Thanks a lot, Chadwell ji. It is all because you requested that we take his opinion in this matter.
On 9 December 2016 at 22:13, C CHADWELL <[email protected]> wrote: > It is so helpful to receive input from those with the maximum > knowledge/familiarity with a genus, especially > for examples we have been uncertain about. > > *Important though, that Professor Richards is made aware of the location, > altitude and month of flowering - just* > *in case they impact upon his opinion. Perhaps an autumn-flowering > variant?* > > He has, as indicated in his e-mail about the Primula photographed at > Munsyari, which he considers is P.boothii, > recognised an autumn-flowering variant of that species, as subspecies > *autumnalis*. > > *Naturally, it is of special interest to members of this group, when a > species, subspecies or variety has their range* > *extended into Indian territory or recognised only in Indian territory.* > > *As far as I know, Richards 'determination' (not sure if he would count it > as such) for this plant from Gori Valley means this * > *represents the first record of Primula gracilipes in Uttarakhand, as is > the case for Primula boothii at Munsyari.* > > > Best Wishes, > > > Chris Chadwell > > > 81 Parlaunt Road > SLOUGH > SL3 8BE > UK > > www.shpa.org.uk > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > *From:* J.M. Garg <[email protected]> > *To:* efloraofindia <[email protected]> > *Cc:* Nidhan Singh <[email protected]>; Balkar Arya < > [email protected]>; Dr. Pankaj Kumar <[email protected]> > *Sent:* Friday, 9 December 2016, 12:29 > *Subject:* Fwd: Fwd: [efloraofindia:258689] Gori Valley Tour: Primula for > identification.. > > Thanks a lot, Richards ji. > These were clicked in Gori Valley, Uttarakhand, India (possibly in 1st > week of Oct. 2012). > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: *JOHN RICHARDS* > Date: 9 December 2016 at 15:43 > Subject: Re: Fwd: [efloraofindia:140534] Gori Valley Tour: Primula for > identification.. > To: "J.M. Garg" <[email protected]> > > > Thank you for these images. I am not sure where they were taken or at what > time of year. At present I am assuming that they are taken in spring. This > is a farinose plant (at least those taken from the side) with small erect > sepals which can only be P. gracilipes a common and widespread spring > flowering forest species in Nepal. With this farina the only other > possibility is P. irregularis which has bigger, stiffer, spreading sepals > with teeth. > > John Richards > > > On Friday, 9 December 2016, 5:57, J.M. Garg <[email protected]> wrote: > > > Hi, Richards ji, > Forwarding for any assistance in the matter pl. as requested by Chadwell > ji & Pam ji. > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: *J.M. Garg* <[email protected]> > Date: 9 December 2016 at 10:25 > Subject: Fwd: [efloraofindia:140534] Gori Valley Tour: Primula for > identification.. > To: efloraofindia <[email protected] m > <[email protected]>> > Cc: Nidhan Singh <[email protected]>, Balkar Arya < > [email protected]> > > > Forwarding again for Id assistance please. > Some earlier relevant feedback: > It may be Prumula sessilis. > Krishan Lal > This is very strange... it cant be Primula sessilis as in sessilis petals > will have pointed tips but here they are blunt two lobes. It looks like > deformed form of Primula denticulata but thats a wild guess. I might be > missing something.... > Regards > Pankaj > Would you be kind enough to tell me the altitudes of the TWO different > species you have posted images of? The FIRST (7 images) which you say was > near a water source is clearly different fro the SECOND (the final two > images); do you possibly have any additional images of the latter. > > Neither are close to Primula denticulata nor Primula vulgaris - which is > not a native of the Himalaya. > > Knowing the different altitudes (the habitats are clearly very different) > will help my efforts to identify them. Would you also supply approximate > dates of flowering? - Chadwell ji > My request for altitudes where the *two* sets of photos were taken has > not been answered. > Am I correct that the last two images are *not* from the same plant? > I am willing to take a further look but need some input from you to help > narrow down the > options nor waste time - that would not be fair on me. > Best Wishes, > Chris Chadwell > > I noticed, the time on the photographs are matching for all pics, but just > incase the individuals are differrent. > Thanks and regards > Pankaj > OK but what is the approximate altitude and what do you mean by a water > source? > Can you describe the habitat please? > Best Wishes, > Chris Chadwell > > I am sorry to delay the matter, I have two submissions: > 1. The altitude of the place was around 1500-1800 m, and the pics do all > belong to one taxon only (may be more than one individuals). The > differences are due to two different cameras. The place, locality and time > is same. > 2. The habitat was a small seasonal stream, on exposed slope. The water > just enough to keep a few meters wet and dripping. > I will be happy to know your valued opinions, thanks for all your efforts. > Nidhan Singh > Pankaj, I agree with your direction on this. The pedicels are too long for > P. denticulata or P. erosa (thus your suggestion of deformed). The whole > plant looks like it could belong in the Petiolares Section, but that > doesn't fit with the last two detailed images showing farinose pedicels and > emarginate corolla lobe shape. > I will have to think more on this, but I would welcome more suggestions. > Pam > This really is proving to be a mystery! Not that many Primulas are known > from Uttarakhand and none > seem to fit the plant you have photographed. Mind you, I cannot think > what it is. *Perhaps someone can forward* > *the images to Professor Richards for his thoughts? Could it be something > special? Late flowering, low-* > *elevation, seemingly contradictory characteristics.....* > > I agree with the thoughts of Pam Eveleigh. The foliage and habit of the > first images suggest must be a Petiolarid yet > the last two images contradict this. You have assured me the last two > images are from the same population - though I > can be forgiven for thinking they might have been from a different species > as the pedicels are much longer and the leaf > shape different (much narrower). Pity you did not photograph both upper > and lower surfaces of same flowers and foliage. > The use of different cameras and exposure issues complicate matters > further. > > Are there any Petiolares section Primula with such pronounced emarginate > petals? The first images are superficially > similar to what I understand is Primula boothii susbp. autumnalis (have > just posted images of this taken by my eldest > son in Nepal) which as the name suggests flowers late in the year and is > found at modest elevations, especially near a 'water source' (though > most Himalayan Primulas "like their feet wet", yet the ends of the petals > in that are nothing like your plant. > Most peculiar and defeating me, for the present. > Best Wishes, > Chris Chadwell > > > > > > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: *Nidhan Singh* <[email protected]> > Date: 14 December 2012 at 07:56 > Subject: [efloraofindia:140534] Gori Valley Tour: Primula for > identification.. > To: indiantreepix <indiantreepix@googlegroups. com > <[email protected]>> > > > Dear All, > > This very beautiful herb was shot from near a water source...a Primula > species...shows similarity with P. vulgaris...wanted to know exact > identification...you will notice the pictures without date have bluish > tinge..which was not natural..only due to camera settings..actual colour is > bright pink...hope to get id... > > -- > Regards, > > Dr. Nidhan Singh > Assistant Professor > Department of Botany > I.B. (PG) College > Panipat-132103 Haryana > Ph.: 09416371227 > > -- > > > > > > > -- > With regards, > J.M.Garg > 'Creating awareness of Indian Flora & Fauna' > <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Jmgarg1> > Winner of Wipro-NFS Sparrow Awards 2014 for efloraofindia > <https://sites.google.com/site/efloraofindia/award-for-efloraofindia>. > For identification, learning, discussion & documentation of Indian Flora, > please visit/ join our Efloraofindia Google e-group > <https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/indiantreepix> (largest in the > world- around 2700 members & 2,40,000 messages on 31.3.16) or Efloraofindia > website <https://sites.google.com/site/efloraofindia/> (with a species > database of more than 11,000 species & 2,20,000 images). > The whole world uses my Image Resource > <http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:J.M.Garg> of more than a > thousand species & eight thousand images of Birds, Butterflies, Plants etc. > (arranged alphabetically & place-wise). You can also use them for free as > per Creative Commons license attached with each image. > Also author of 'A Photoguide to the Birds of Kolkata & Common Birds of > India'. > > > > -- > With regards, > J.M.Garg > 'Creating awareness of Indian Flora & Fauna' > <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Jmgarg1> > Winner of Wipro-NFS Sparrow Awards 2014 for efloraofindia > <https://sites.google.com/site/efloraofindia/award-for-efloraofindia>. > For identification, learning, discussion & documentation of Indian Flora, > please visit/ join our Efloraofindia Google e-group > <https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/indiantreepix> (largest in the > world- around 2700 members & 2,40,000 messages on 31.3.16) or Efloraofindia > website <https://sites.google.com/site/efloraofindia/> (with a species > database of more than 11,000 species & 2,20,000 images). > The whole world uses my Image Resource > <http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:J.M.Garg> of more than a > thousand species & eight thousand images of Birds, Butterflies, Plants etc. > (arranged alphabetically & place-wise). You can also use them for free as > per Creative Commons license attached with each image. > Also author of 'A Photoguide to the Birds of Kolkata & Common Birds of > India'. > > > > > > -- > With regards, > J.M.Garg > 'Creating awareness of Indian Flora & Fauna' > <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Jmgarg1> > Winner of Wipro-NFS Sparrow Awards 2014 for efloraofindia > <https://sites.google.com/site/efloraofindia/award-for-efloraofindia>. > For identification, learning, discussion & documentation of Indian Flora, > please visit/ join our Efloraofindia Google e-group > <https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/indiantreepix> (largest in the > world- around 2700 members & 2,40,000 messages on 31.3.16) or Efloraofindia > website <https://sites.google.com/site/efloraofindia/> (with a species > database of more than 11,000 species & 2,20,000 images). > The whole world uses my Image Resource > <http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:J.M.Garg> of more than a > thousand species & eight thousand images of Birds, Butterflies, Plants etc. > (arranged alphabetically & place-wise). You can also use them for free as > per Creative Commons license attached with each image. > Also author of 'A Photoguide to the Birds of Kolkata & Common Birds of > India'. > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the > Google Groups "efloraofindia" group. > To unsubscribe from this topic, visit https://groups.google.com/d/ > topic/indiantreepix/6nqzl6l5i2o/unsubscribe. > To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to > [email protected]. > To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. > Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/indiantreepix. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > > > -- With regards, J.M.Garg 'Creating awareness of Indian Flora & Fauna' <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Jmgarg1> Winner of Wipro-NFS Sparrow Awards 2014 for efloraofindia <https://sites.google.com/site/efloraofindia/award-for-efloraofindia>. For identification, learning, discussion & documentation of Indian Flora, please visit/ join our Efloraofindia Google e-group <https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/indiantreepix> (largest in the world- around 2700 members & 2,40,000 messages on 31.3.16) or Efloraofindia website <https://sites.google.com/site/efloraofindia/> (with a species database of more than 11,000 species & 2,20,000 images). The whole world uses my Image Resource <http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:J.M.Garg> of more than a thousand species & eight thousand images of Birds, Butterflies, Plants etc. (arranged alphabetically & place-wise). You can also use them for free as per Creative Commons license attached with each image. Also author of 'A Photoguide to the Birds of Kolkata & Common Birds of India'. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "efloraofindia" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To post to this group, send an email to [email protected]. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/indiantreepix. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
