Hi Amelia. Amen to the second-last line in particular, and the 1,2,3. The groanings of our spirits to the Spirit are the stuff of deep prayer, of deep connection with God. Celebration is the stuff of deep prayer too. And the Celts were/are particularly good at that same deep connection in the mundane of the everyday as well.
And Amen to struggle and questioning the nature of our relationship with God, rather than assuming God will fix it for us just because we pray. Prayer should be amidst life. But how we pray reveals our theology (consciously or unconsciously), and we need to be conscious of that, especially as leaders, because modelling shapes (changes or reinforces) beliefs, and that's pastoral too. I'll pray for those who need rain, but I'll also wonder at the impact of humanity that changes weather patterns, among other things. Here's another thread-starter: when we pray to God as Lord or Father, aren't we just perpetuating patriarchal patterns of dominance? I know th at's kind of how Jesus prayed, but actually he used the Aramaic term Abba, which I gather is quite a different word, closer perhaps to Dad or Dadda. The power in that relational term is quite different. Dorothy Lee, Professor of New Testament at the UFT in Melbourne, wrote an excellent article some years ago about the relationship between Jesus and God in John's gospel -- it's a relationship that specifically challenges and models alternatives to the patriarchal patterns of power: they give up power, give away inheritance, allow alternatives, suffer with others and alone, and die. Yes, God died on the cross, in Jesus. Regards, Rohan Rohan Pryor Manager, Information Technology Services Synod of Victoria and Tasmania Uniting Church in Australia Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Ph: (03) 9251 5243 Fax: (03) 9654 4110 Website: http://vic.uca.org.au -----Original Message----- From: Amelia Koh-Butler [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, August 13, 2004 10:36 AM To: 'Rodd Clarkson'; Rohan Pryor Cc: 'insights-l' Subject: RE: Praying for Rain Bunch of Spoil-sports! Driving out bush and trading rainfall guage levels whenever I phone constituents at home... I would not dare "pray for rain"! 1) I give thanks when we get it. 2) I bring my distress (and the distress of my friends) to God when we don't get it. 3) I wonder at the torrents and at the vastness of a continent and life cycles that have been created by a God that I don't understand. Ah, Elihu - express it for me please! (see Job) It may be a narrow-minded case that neglects... "Who am I that the Creator should be mindful of me?" but it may be worse for me to presume that I should not bring any and every dark concern of heart and mind into the illuminative activity of prayer. The prayers surrounding rain and drought should involve struggle and the questioning of the nature of our relationship with God. I guess it all depens on how important the object of your prayers is... Which one of you would not pray for relief in the case of a loved-ones illness? Does God require our prayers to be logicked beyond the groanings of the spirit within? or is the gut-wrenching cry of the mortal before the immortal just as acceptable? If I sound a little put out... I have been with people as the first rains have fallen in three years. At such a time, there seems to be nothing more spiritual than to pray. Be mindful that there are still some people waiting. - Amelia ------------------------------------------------------ - You are subscribed to the mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, email [EMAIL PROTECTED] and put in the message body 'unsubscribe insights-l' (ell, not one (1)) See: http://nsw.uca.org.au/insights-l-information.htm ------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------------------------------ - You are subscribed to the mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, email [EMAIL PROTECTED] and put in the message body 'unsubscribe insights-l' (ell, not one (1)) See: http://nsw.uca.org.au/insights-l-information.htm ------------------------------------------------------
