I get the sincere vibe this is a big pissing contest. Past US
administrations have basically screwed with the spirit of the
international trading laws (though of course steering generally clear
of actually breaking the letter of them), whereas the EU, hasn't.

Think of it as a prisoners dilemma; the US has a tendency to take the
'rat the other out' position, and the EU tends to do the other thing.
As you may know, the 'right' strategy in prisoner's dilemma is to be
nice on the first round, and to reciprocate on all future rounds. The
EU is finally reciprocating. Bad timing, of course - the
administration just switched so now they're just setting a stupid
precedent. Then again, Obama isn't moving out of wars as fast as the
EU had hoped, and Obama tends to stick his nose into local EU affairs
which has rubbed off a few points of his otherwise impeccable EU
support.

Some of the crud the US has pulled in the EU in recent years:

 - Drag half the countries here into a silly war based on what
europeans widely perceive as gross incompetence or possibly knowingly
fabricated evidence. The war is not very popular anymore in the US,
but that's nothing compared to the opposition here.
 - Turning the entire nation of Ireland into a lobbyist mouthpiece for
US interest.
 - Killing iceland, economically. Okay, not EU, and iceland is partly
to blame too, but, it was a hit very close to home, and iceland has
been in talks to join the EU for a long time.
 - By letting S&P and Moody's run rampant, and (very much the EU's own
fault), believing their credit ratings were correct instead of what
they actually were (utter fabrications, driven by a combination of
incompetence and a conflict of interest, in that the people who
benefit from a high credit rating pay for the research. Of course
that's going to fall on its ass) - the EU got stuck holding far more
of this economic crisis' bill than the US, even though the US 'started
it', so to speak. Essentially, the EU is blaming the US for this
crisis. I blame the EU just as much for trusting the US economic house
of cards, but this is not a popular viewpoint.
 - turning EU-owned airplanes around midair for frivolous terrorism
security theater.
 - many more things that smack of bullying.

Only recently, probably kindled by the crisis, has this 'why are we
letting the US walk over us without reciprocating some of the pain'
theme been coming up in discussions around the EU. If you need proof
that there really is quite a pissing contest going on, consider
Chicago 2016. The EU has more members in the Olympic Committee than
any other continent. I realized too late, but I would have bet a
decent amount of dosh on Chicago getting canned in the first round at
the bookies.

As an additional factor, Neelie Kroes, currently European Commissioner
of Competition, is _very_ popular, having charged companies that
generally deserved it for billions in fines, including many US
companies (such as microsoft).

Long story short: If I had to give my advice to snorcle, I would say
that without divesting MySQL or making some other big expensive
gesture, the deal will be put on hold as long as the EU can manage to
do so. Alternatively, get the administration involved so a political
trade can be made - some sort of gesture from the US in exchange for
leniency on US financial interests, such as the snorcle deal.


Some fairly important footnotes:

 - I live and was born in the EU, though as I've lived in the US for a
while too, I take an interest in across-the-pond politics and news.

 - I don't necessarily believe all of what I just wrote - I'm writing
down the consensus perception within the EU, as far as I know it. As
these things usually are, it's really way more complicated than this.
I also think that The Sun/Oracle deal, even with MySQL, is fine.
Between postgres and the untouchable open source base of MySQL,
there's really no anti-competitive issue here. Morally speaking it is
not right to hold back this deal just to reciprocate US bullying, but
practically speaking we've been taking the high road for a looong time
and the US never seems to grow up, so I can see why nobody really
wants to stick their neck out _for_ the US and apply pressure to let
this deal move forward.

 - If I said something that's disagreeable, please consider that this
post is intended merely as useful background information on the
political machinations between the US and the EU, from the EU
perspective. I'm sure I've overstated some concerns and skipped many
more - as I said, it's complicated.

On Oct 10, 6:19 pm, Casper Bang <[email protected]> wrote:
> From what I've seen in the blogosphere, the critique is mostly coming
> from from stakeholders and I imagine that includes Mårten as a
> shareholder from the Sun deal! So I think we should let the EU resolve
> this on their own, MySQL and Oracle XE are similar enough to warrant
> concern for many. It's no different than what Microsoft is subjected
> to.
>
> /Casper
>
> On 10 Okt., 17:13, TorNorbye <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Oct 10, 2:38 am, Phil <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > > That said, I think the EU investigation should be resolved by Oracle
> > > agreeing to divest itself of MySQL...
>
> > Did you see what former MySQL CEO Mårten Mickos wrote?
>
> >http://news.cnet.com/8301-13505_3-10370162-16.html
>
> > -- Tor
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