I do find listening to a group of techie friends discussing current topics entertaining. I usually learn something new with each broadcast, even if I can't apply it directly to my job. I've always enjoyed these podcasts and my hope is that others and myself will continue to do so.
What I find tiring is the blind defense of anything Apple does. I know that Joe doesn't absolutely take that position, but even when he agrees that maybe Apple is doing something poorly, he seems to immediately come up with an excuse for the actions. Fanboys in general are irritating (and usually non-rational), and Joe's definitely an Apple fanboy. So discussions about things happening with Apple don't really bother me, but blindly excusing everything Apple is doing does bother me. I invite Joe to listen to the podcasts because it might sound different than it felt when the podcast was made. As for Android, at least I can write a Java program to run on Android, so that gives it more relevance in "The _Java_ Posse" for listeners. But even there, a list of (hardware) product announcements gets a bit boring. I do value Joe's input when the topic of user interface comes up. I thought he was great in the Roundup episode about design - a very enjoyable session. But while he tries to take a wider "business" perspective, which I can relate to, I disagree with many of his conclusions, especially since on the podcast they sound overly biased in favor of anything Apple is doing but other companies don't always get the same support. Just being creative, creating a good user interface and having an extremely charismatic CEO doesn't excuse everything else. On Jun 15, 9:10 pm, "Joe Nuxoll (Java Posse)" <[email protected]> wrote: > That is a bit harsh, Richard, and frankly a bit rude. You may > certainly walk away, and to be honest that does bum us out (even me). > We know we can't please everyone, but we do honestly hope not to > deeply upset anyone. > > There are many intense technical discussions about nuances of language > features, or configuration details of the latest build system, etc on > the Java Posse, and to be honest a lot of those discussions only > interest me slightly. Sometimes an aspect will truly peak my > interest, but not all of them. Clearly those are your favorites, and > clearly you and I are not similar. I have written a very large amount > of software in several languages in my career, but have always > gravitated toward API design and user interface (human interaction). > Now I have found my happy place where I get to focus on user > interface, human interaction, and actual business strategy without > having to type code all day. I work mostly in pictures - and talking > to people. > > On the podcast, we talk about things that interest us - and in many > ways I feel that I'm pushing hard trying to balance discussions toward > a more rounded viewpoint. I think folks over-react to my Apple > opinions because I am not responding from a developer-only > perspective. I like Apple because their user experience is ground- > breaking and consistently great (not just my opinion). They're also > wildly successful in business (not just my opinion). They don't focus > on developers as their target audience - especially not developers for > non-Apple platforms. Their focus is on the end users. Dick hates > Apple because they impose limits on developers on their platforms and > devices - thus he has jumped aggressively into the Android camp (even > added an Android section to the show). I don't like how they limit > developers either, but I *understand* it quite well. The two of us > barely overlap in these areas. Ironically, neither side of this > debate really has anything to do with Java. It's just what's > happening in the tech industry lately, and we find ourselves in a room > talking about it. With a few microphones. Note: Carl and Tor have > strong opinions on these topics too. Mine is the highest contrast to > Dick's. > > Perhaps you would prefer the Dick Wall show. He is a very interesting > and quite delightful person, but as you probably have figured out, he > is a 100% heads-down developer and is maniacally passionate about his > work. This is a wonderful thing. I am not a fan of staying within > the myopic developer-only perspective when we discuss things, because > then you essentially aren't actually understanding the issues at > hand. Weird analogy: it's like trying to build a beautiful house out > of playing cards, while unaware that you're on top of the mast of a > small sail boat. There are many very important forces at work that > you *should* consider to be successful, but of course you don't have > to! > > So - any tension folks feel between Dick and myself is simply a > reflection of our differing core interests. I think Dick is one of > the nicest guys on the planet, but we certainly don't see eye-to-eye > on many of the issues in the technology world today. You clearly are > more aligned with Dick Wall's viewpoints - so great. He's a great guy > to be aligned with. > > If Dick Wall wanted to make this the Dick Wall show (which I'd say the > Java Posse is about 80-90% of today), he's a guy with enough drive and > skill to totally pull it off. If I were to make a Joe Nuxoll show (no > chance), I'd want Dick on it - but I'd make sure he was open to > talking about things from more than the developer-only viewpoint. > > Deeper question: Should the Java Posse podcast be a developer- > perspective only show? I already know your vote, Richard. > > - Joe > > On Jun 14, 9:02 pm, RichardVowles <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > I'm afraid that with so much noise on the podcast (as much as Dick > > tries to deflect it) it has really becoming the "Lets talk about what > > Joe wants to talk about" posse. The latest podcast I'm afraid for me > > is the last straw, I just give up - Joe is so much noise, designer- > > speak and Apple fanboyism it simply isn't worth listening anymore - > > the other three just can't compete with it. Even interesting tech > > discussions get sidelined. I'll go find my own news from now on, I'll > > miss Dick, Tor and Carl's conversations, but will relish never > > listening to Joe speak ever again. > > > I totally understand others like it the way it is, but I have just had > > enough. > > > On Jun 12, 11:30 pm, Mikael Grev <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > The Java Posse has as much obligation to only talk about Java as the > > > Ponytail Posse would have to only talk about ponytails (and Jonathan > > > Schwartz). > > > > Things would be different if the podcast was named "The Posse that > > > talks about Java". -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "The Java Posse" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected]. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/javaposse?hl=en.
