On Thursday, December 22, 2011 5:42:12 PM UTC+1, Dick Wall wrote: > > As is often the case Reinier - you seem to have got your enthusiasm making > statements that are far to over general. > > Here is the history from my development machine (not one of the ones I use > for Scala training) along with the number of times I have started the scala > REPL > > dick@Apollo:~$ history | wc -l > 500 > dick@Apollo:~$ history | grep scala | wc -l > 31 > dick@Apollo:~$ history | grep "sbt console" | wc -l > 40 >
Sure, that sounds about right. I open my scrapbook (which is the exact same thing as a REPL, just not called a REPL - you've apparently missed the point but I'll get into that next paragraph) about a tenth as often as you do, but then, java is easier to understand so there's less for me to try out. Here's where you missed the point. Yes, what REPLs do is very handy. But I don't have to use a spoon to eat soup; I can use a spork as well. java has no REPL. But eclipse has scrapbook pages. These do everything REPLs do and more. It's almost exactly like sbt console in that I get the project's classpath 'for free'. Now, don't get me wrong, the eclipse scrapbook functionality has boatloads that needs to be done. Having to be a wizard at using command line foo to select expressions so I can evaluate them is frankly ridiculously (enter should just eval the expression I just typed, or at least give me a shortcut key to do it, exceptions shouldn't be pasted straight into the scrapbook but shown in the console view, etc, etc, etc), but learning an all new language just because the scrapbook functionality bothers you seems rather drastic. It would be easier to write an entirely new scrapbook plugin for eclipse! I stand by my point that a REPL, as compared to java's advanced debuggers, is a pointless addition except as a teaching tool. I have _NEVER_ met any person that continued arguing in favour of scala / python / some other language with built in REPL that actually knew how to use the eclipse / netbeans / intellij debugger well. Then again I don't think I ever asked specifically on the javaposse groups, so maybe somebody's out there who can tell me what I'm missing. > > I am a pretty experienced Scala developer now, with about 3 years behind > me, and I start the Scala REPL to try stuff out every day I am developing, > often several times a day (assuming I don't just leave it running > constantly). REPLs are far from pointless in real life, and I would not > want to use a language without one. Prior to Scala, I used to use Python > every chance I got and I used to (and still do) fire up the python shell at > the drop of a hat to try out some idea or other. A REPL may not appear to > be all that useful to you, maybe because you are used to using languages > that don't offer one, but that doesn't make it true for everyone else. > > Incidentally, sbt console starts up the current project with all jars and > classes in the project already on the REPL class path. Combined with tab > completion in the Scala REPL, it is an excellent way of trying out ideas > and exploring unknowns, like interactively experimenting with third party > ReST web services (I practically developed our interface to confluence this > way, using the REPL to send requests and explore the resulting XML until I > got what I needed) or just getting a feel for a new API. > > I don't use it as my only tool, and I don't doubt that you don't find them > interesting, but I also can't let a statement like "REPLs are pointless > in real life" when I use them all the time. > > Dick > > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "The Java Posse" group. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msg/javaposse/-/Y6-Go90KdoQJ. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected]. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/javaposse?hl=en.
