This whole conversation has been fascinating to me now that I've had
time to read it. It all goes back to my original concept of Frame of
Reference.
I'm the opposite of Brian. Brian is sighted, and spends his days trying
to help blind people learn software. I am blind, and spend my days
trying to help sighted people learn software.
If my volunteers took the approach, "You can't teach me unless you do
things the way I do them," I'd be out of a job. I can't do them the way
the volunteers do them. That's not discrimination. That's reality.
What we have hear is a need to adapt one's descriptions to the task at
hand. This morning, for instance, I was teaching my tax center
coordinator how to access our appointment schedule.
How I would do it with JAWS:
Load the page.
Press Insert F7 for the links list.
Press the letter s until I hear Sign In, then press enter.
How Sam (who is sighted) does it:
Load the page.
Click on Sign-in in the upper right corner of the window.
Problem: I didn't know Sign-in was in the upper right corner of the
window, because it's almost the first thing JAWS reads. So I just
assumed it was somewhere near the top of the screen, but I had no idea
whether it was left, right or center.
Once Sam told me it was in the upper right corner, I was able to store
that knowledge away to interact with Gloria and Jim, who also needed the
information.
It's all about purpose. One of the most important things I teach in
Taxwise software is how to link from one form to another. The way I have
to do it is to hit Enter on the line to enter Forms mode, then press F9,
then get out of forms mode and hit Control End to go to the bottom of
the page, then use the arrow keys to find "new" and "existing" and then
select the form I want. Do you think that helps my sighted volunteers?
No. For them the instructions are:
Click on the line you need on the 1040.
Click the green arrow next to that line.
Click the little piece of paper with the chain attached to it.
Click either New or Existing depending on whether the form is already in
your return.
Select the form you want.
Would I ever use the second instruction set myself? Absolutely not. Does
knowing the second instruction set make me a better teacher to my
volunteers? You bet. And I work in rooms full of sighted volunteers, so
if I intend to be good at my job of teaching them how to do your taxes,
I'd better know how to reach them in the way that makes the most sense
to them and taps into their frame of reference. I think that is Brian's
point.
If you never need to interact with sighted people then perhaps you don't
need to know their jargon. Actually, I was surprised how many people
have never double clicked before. Personally, I would find not knowing
that jargon limiting, but that's because in my day-to-day it would be.
In your day-to-day it might not be. Different strokes.
Brad
On 2/4/2016 3:34 PM, Jean Menzies wrote:
Hello Brian,
You said:
The point I was trying to get across, and it seems what I've said has
had limited success in that department, is that any user of a computer
had better understand how the general jargon of computer use relates
to their actual technique of accomplishing a given action.
My response:
But why should I struggle to learn the intricacies of “sighted world
jargon” such as mouse click vernacular when I don’t need to? Yes, I
know how to use the Jaws left and right click simulations, and when
and how I use them. But does it really matter that I understand the
relationship to a real mouse? E.g., that left click is select, for
instance? It sounds like an effort not toward computer literacy, but
toward making the blind user fall more squarely into the sighted user
camp. Yes, I understand computerese instructions I find on the
Internet, and have no trouble using them. (except for when it tells me
to click on things JAWS can’t find.) But that’s another story.
I agree with the poster that a more appropriate use of language here
would be to “select” something, etc. In other words, name the
action/result, rather than referencing it through sighted jargon.
Jean
*From:* Brian Vogel <mailto:[email protected]>
*Sent:* Thursday, February 4, 2016 1:13 PM
*To:* [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>
*Subject:* Re: Improving my teaching approach and/or sensitivity
On Thu, Feb 4, 2016 at 12:10 pm, Soronel Haetir
<[email protected]> wrote:
Her blindness stemmed from an unformed visual cortex
rather than anything actually wrong with her eyes. It turns out those
same brain circuits are involved in picture development whether
something is seen or not. So even the assumption that someone can
relate to that sort of description is not necessarily well founded.
Soronel,
Which circles right back around to ground zero. I have
definitely been trying to describe my "general client" without getting
too bogged down in the idiosyncracies that can and do pop up as a
direct result of an individual's sensory history.
I actually do what you've mentioned as far as giving
directions and, for instance, have never used the phrase, "swipe over
that text to select it," because that method of selection means
nothing, or virtually nothing, to anyone who has never been capable of
using it and is of no help even to those who did and could, but aren't
able to now. The point I was trying to get across, and it seems what
I've said has had limited success in that department, is that any user
of a computer had better understand how the general jargon of computer
use relates to their actual technique of accomplishing a given
action. I actively teach both, tying the two together.
As far as my personal attempts to customize my instruction
to a given client, I don't think I could make it any more clear than I
have that I do, indeed, do this as a standard practice. It just goes
with the territory. If ever, "one size fits all," were blatantly false
it's in the case of one-on-one instruction for assistive technology of
any variety.
Brian
--
Brad Martin
[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>
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