Oh please Donna, the drama!!
I didn't see any cruelty in Ben's observation.
Rob
----- Original Message -----
From: Donna Marie Vincent
To: jobs@lists.nyphp.org
Sent: Saturday, August 09, 2008 1:32 PM
Subject: Re: [nyphp-jobs] Freelance Remote PHP/MySQL gig with about 5+
yrsofexp & good client references
This is cruel and inappropriate. It's more about killing off your
competition to build yourself up than it is about providing helpful
information. Barbaric is another word that comes to mind.
----- Original Message ----
From: RDP <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Andrew Wint <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: jobs@lists.nyphp.org
Sent: Saturday, August 9, 2008 12:41:27 PM
Subject: Re: [nyphp-jobs] Freelance Remote PHP/MySQL gig with about 5+ yrs
ofexp & good client references
I agree with Ben! Yay Ben!
----- Original Message -----
From: Sean Fulton
To: Andrew Wint
Cc: RDP ; jobs@lists.nyphp.org
Sent: Saturday, August 09, 2008 12:25 PM
Subject: Re: [nyphp-jobs] Freelance Remote PHP/MySQL gig with about 5+ yrs
ofexp & good client references
I disagree. This wasn't a former employer complaining about a consultant's
work, this was another consultant, a competitor if you will, stating as fact
something that no one can possibly double-check. I think it's unfair, and am
surprised that, on a list dedicated to helping consultants find jobs, you folks
would not be more concerned about it. I think this is the first time I have
seen someone in a public forum accuse someone of something and not be called to
provide proof of their claims. Very puzzling.
No one knows what the job requirements were, what the client's expectations
were, or what the budget was. Did the client provide enough time and budget to
have the job done right, or did they just say, "Get it done for next to
nothing," and then when they realized the short-sidedness of their approach,
hire Ben to clean up the mess rather than go back to the developer they
low-balled and admit that they didn't give him enough time and $$ to do the job
correctly. We don't know. Ben won't even tell the list who the client was or
produce evidence of the inferior work. So to my mind, this whole thread is
quite unfair to the developer who originally posted his availability and should
be dropped.
Finally, as you read this, please keep in mind that we are a company that
employs people on this list, that's why I subscribe. I have employed developers
here in the US and in six other countries. I find *no* geo-political
differences in coding skills. We evaluate developers based on samples, client
references and their ability to follow directions. I have had more than a few
developers who are so focused on developing "great code" that they completely
ignore the project specs, budget and time-lines. Those people don't last long,
but people who follow directions do.
Again, without knowing the original assignment that Sundar was given and
what went on between he and the client at that time, facts which I doubt even
Ben knows, we really can't draw any useful conclusions nor should we try.
Just my $.02.
sean
Andrew Wint wrote:
All he did was to provide transparency, now we are discussing the issues.
Kristina gave very valid points about the 'delivery of crappy code' and not
being able to take action because they are in another country.
Another point is that this why we have standards of development
practices, these standards shouldn't be compromised they can bend a bit but not
break. Sundar needs to seek them out and adhere to them.
I know it may seem harsh but it may help Sundar down the line in his
growth. As well as protect a small struggling company, thinking they are
saving money but falling into a trap.
Ben did a good thing.
On Aug 9, 2008, at 10:50 AM, RDP wrote:
I'm sorry Donna, but I disagree.
It's perfectly fine to express a view about someone's work.
Of course we make errors in our code, everybody does. But you can't
evaluate experience without examining ones work.
And employers DO give out this information. Especially if an
individual was let go because of inability.
Finally, I'm having a problem imagining rows of unemployed PHP coders
down and out on skid-row in cardboard boxes, homeless, because their work was
criticized.
Bye,
Rob
----- Original Message -----
From: Donna Marie Vincent
To: jobs@lists.nyphp.org
Sent: Saturday, August 09, 2008 9:26 AM
Subject: Re: [nyphp-jobs] Freelance Remote PHP/MySQL gig with about
5+ yrs ofexp & good client references
It's not only unethical to publicly disparage an individual's ability
to perform a job, you could be subject to legal action.
Have you ever made an error while performing your job duties?
Even a former employer would not give out this type of information.
Do you want to be responsible for someone not getting work, and ending up
homeless on the street, because of your personal opinion about their work,
which may or may not be valid?
This is not the same as publicly criticizing a particular product, or
a company's business practice.
--- On Sat, 8/9/08, Ben Sgro <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
From: Ben Sgro <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [nyphp-jobs] Freelance Remote PHP/MySQL gig with
about 5+ yrs of exp & good client references
To:
Cc: jobs@lists.nyphp.org
Date: Saturday, August 9, 2008, 2:17 AM
Hey,I audited a site this guy built - it was full of holes - SQL injection,
XSS, default passwords on CMS admin accounts, etc.Also, the code was PHP4
w/HTML sprinkled all over it, cut and paste, no functions. No layouts,
templates or smarty.Basically, impossible and very time consuming to make
updates.Be sure to request some source before you work with him.- Bensundar
rajan wrote:>> Hi ,>>> I'm a Freelance Telecommuting PHP/MySQL Programmer with
about 5+ yrs > of experience in building web applications .>>> Following are
the type of small / contract jobs that I take:> /Creating Custom scripts>
Member signup with email verification & login with sessionauthentication>
Dynamic PDF File generation from the database information using FPDF >
libraries> Command line processing of PHP scripts> Installing CAPTCHA security
code for the forms> Google Maps <http://maps.google.com/> API to display a
location with> pop-up info> XML parsing to database> CSV parsing to database>
RSS feeds using Carp> Handling File uploads> Generating statistics reports from
the database values> Generating Graphical reports from the database values>
Generating Excel download from the database values> Working with complex
queries in Mysql console> Building application with SEO friendly URLs>
Installing MySQL , Apache , PHP , SVN , AWStats & software apps in > linux
boxes> /> I can also take up bigger projects with proper specification documents
> along with the UI/HTML prototypes.>>> Checkout my online portfolio at
> http://www.sundarrajan.com > <http://www.sundarrajan.com/> to know more
> about my skill-set , > experiences , projects as well as client
> references.>> As a verified premier paypal member since 2005 with over 70
> seller > reputation , I can accept paypal / credit card payments.>> Please
> do contact me for further details , if you have any jobs.>>>> -- > With
> regards,> Sundar> Phone: (+1) 510.455.4387>>>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------>>
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