I agree with Charlie too, and Jay as well. Finding helpful
JSP/Servlet/J2EE/Java books is one thing. Especially if you expect the book
to aid in migration from a other server-side technology. Having the
community write a book would be great, however it requires a lot of
volunteer effort. It was tried by the Esperanto Group,
http://www.esperanto.org.nz/jspbook/, but never caught on with support from
others.
Speaking from experience, there are countless people willing to use the free
material, however there are very few willing to contribute. I webmaster over
at JSP Insider - http://www.jspinsider.com, and if there is really interest
in this project I'll gladly help as well as provide web space. The site
already has much code, FAQ and tutorials. Combining it all might make a book
itself :)
Jayson Falkner
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Excellent, Charlie is right on target. I have spent much money picking up
> books only to find them inadequate for what I need to do. Perhaps this is
a
> good opportunity for this community to take the initiative to write a
book,
> collaboratively, that addresses the need (we have been waiting for that
book
> that has it all). In addition, code good examples of actual sites out
there
> (if permitted) can also enhance the learning curve.
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Charles Arehart" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "JRun-Talk" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Sunday, July 29, 2001 10:56 PM
> Subject: RE: Learning path
>
>
> > Bert, I know you're asking for materials that "aren't just tutorial but
> also
> > design and case study", but since others have asked about the general
> > transition from ASP (or CF, PHP, Perl, etc.) to servlets/JSP, here are
> some
> > thoughts that cover a little of all three. Folks really do need to learn
> > quite a lot to be truly effective: Java, as a base, for sure, and of
> course
> > J2EE (servlets, JSP's and EJB's, at least) in general.
> >
> > A big challenge, I find, is that the beginning Java books often focus on
> > teaching client-side Java for a substantial percentage of the book.
While
> > books like Core Java 2 and Beginning Java 2 are highly commended and
> rightly
> > so, they have upwards of 40% or more on applets, swing, awt, etc. It's
not
> a
> > bad thing, but it reflects an old mentality that "surely anyone who
wants
> to
> > learn java wants to build applets and client applications", which of
> course
> > folks making the server-side transition may not. Thinking in Java, to
its
> > credit, devotes only a single chapter each to client- and server-side
> > development, being especially solid at the core of java without a focus
on
> > either "side" of the platform.
> >
> > On the other hand, most J2EE-level books not only presume you already
know
> > java but they're generally focused on teaching web app development to
> those
> > experienced java programmers. As such, not only must you know Java to
> really
> > get into the books, but you have to weed through some web app
development
> > info you may already know--or bear with the author's potential newness
to
> > web app development (I find a lot of J2EE books fail to suggest or
> > demonstrate such simple things as JavaScript, for instance. OK, so one
can
> > learn it elsewhere, but someone needs to lead those using J2EE as their
> > first web app platform to appreciate why it's worth doing).
> >
> > Then there's the whole debate over EJBs (should you, shouldn't you),
> > understanding the difference between javabeans and EJBs, weeding through
> > books that discuss javabeans for their use in client-side development
> only,
> > etc.
> >
> > Among the more popular resources for server-side development are Core
> > Servlets and JSP, Professional Java Server Programming J2EE Ed.,
> O'Reilly's
> > Enterprise JavaBeans, and others. Of course, Sun has its J2EE tutorial
> > (http://java.sun.com/j2ee/tutorial/index.html), the J2EE Blueprints, and
> > many other resources.
> >
> > At least, in the case of a real walkthrough, the Java Pet Store example
> from
> > Sun is a reasonably complete application and the BluePrints book (online
> and
> > in print as "Java 2 Platform, Enterprise Edition BluePrints") walks one
> > through it and the solutions employed in it. See
> > http://java.sun.com/j2ee/blueprints/ for these and lots more.
> >
> > On another tack, if those making the move to servlets/JSP are also new
to
> > object-oriented programming and design (haven't had C++, SmallTalk, or
> > similar experience), that's another whole level of complexity to be
> > understood (and effectively used). For this, I'd strongly recommend
> Jacquie
> > Barker's "Beginning Java Objects" (Wrox). While some may argue against
it
> as
> > a first java book, I think for the right audience it's great for just
> that.
> > And this audience may be especially well-suited to its approach. I found
> no
> > other book did as good a job at putting OO (programming AND design AND
> > implementation--and even UML and more) all into perspective.
> >
> > Then, there's the whole matter of patterns. You won't get far before
> > discussions of "observers", "proxies", "factories", "facades" and lots
> more
> > start cropping up. Of course, the seminal work is "Design Patterns" from
> > Gamma, et al (with its distinct C++ focus, though still foundational for
> all
> > OO programmers), and one of its co-authors wrote "Pattern Hatching".
There
> > are still other books that lead one through use of design patterns in
> Java.
> > Then there are still more "architecture patterns", including J2EE
patterns
> > covered in a book ("Core J2EE Patterns") and a sun site
> > (http://java.sun.com/j2ee/blueprints/design_patterns/index.html).
> >
> > There's clearly a need in the market for something to address the
audience
> > of folks making the transition from other server-side scripting
languages
> to
> > JSP/Servlets, etc, especially if they're also new to Java. For now, you
> have
> > to pick and choose.
> >
> > On the training front, Macromedia's recognized this need with their
split
> of
> > the former "servlets, jsp and java" class into a new "java for web
> > developers" class focused on just the kind of core java needed to get
> > started, then offering "fasttrack to jsp" to cover JSP basics, and a
> coming
> > "Building j2ee applications with JRun" class (still in the works) to get
> > more into JDBC, servlets, javabeans, EJBs, and more.
> >
> > Then there are sites like jspinsider.com, jguru.com, theserverside.com,
> and
> > others, as well as magazines like Java Developers Journal, Java Pro, and
> > Java Report.
> >
> > I'm sure others will have still more suggested resources, and I'd
> certainly
> > welcome their feedback if any on those mentioned here.
> >
> > /charlie
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Bert [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> > Sent: Thursday, July 26, 2001 3:08 AM
> > To: JRun-Talk
> > Subject: Re: Learning path
> >
> >
> > As a Asp developer making the transition to Java ,Java beans and Jsp
where
> > would anyone suggest his or her learning path be any sites out there not
> > just to get up to speed or tutorials but to design a site or case study
> > using Jsp,Java and Xml etc?
> >
>
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