Oh, I didn't realize you need to keep it read-only, so maybe just placing it as a whole on the Apache servers and doing the "unless otherwise noted, Apache License...." that Apache legal recommended might be best after all. We can work on reducing/updating it after it's moved over. I like the idea of the permanent redirect.

Glen

On 12/02/2012 02:10 PM, Janne Jalkanen wrote:
I can add a 301 permanent redirect, that should take care of search engines.

Let me know when you're ready and I'll make the complete tarballs available. I 
think it might make sense to start with doc.jspwiki.org first.

Note that the main jspwiki.org site is currently read-only 'cos recent Finnish 
court decisions imply that I'm responsible for all content on it, and I don't 
have the time to monitor it, so I'm not risking it, but if anyone else wants to 
grab the site to host in the meantime, let me know.

/Janne

On Dec 2, 2012, at 19:34 , Harry Metske wrote:

well exactly your last point, my guess is that currently many google
searches end up on jspwiki.org.
If we delete content there, we should at least leave pointers to the new
wiki, making sure people can still find us..
And you're right, there is no hurry.

regards,
Harry



On 2 December 2012 18:01, Glen Mazza <glen.ma...@gmail.com> wrote:

Apparently docs.wiki is already all Commons-Licensed (looking at the
license at the bottom of the page), so that can probably move over 100%
immediately, with the corresponding docs.jspwiki site closed down, as well
as the sandbox wiki.  So that's 2 out of 3 right there.

For the rest, I don't see a rush.  I think the main goal should be that
everything on the new Wiki be Apache-licensed.  If we can create it now and
it takes a few months for jspwiki.org to be shrunk, that should be also
OK.  (2) below can probably be done soon--you're just deleting from the
left-side menu the stuff that is already on the main Apache site--and (1)
and (3) more gradually over time.

I would recommend though against jspwiki.org being an endless archive, as
it will keep showing up in Google.  Rather to keep scavenging from it
(either delete unused material, or *move* the material elsewhere but never
just *copy* it and retain it in two places) and let it get smaller and
smaller over time.

Regards,
Glen


On 12/02/2012 11:38 AM, Harry Metske wrote:

In general I agree with Glen that we should thoroughly clean out "the old
stuff".
But I don't like the idea of completely deleting it very soon.
I prefer starting with a clean 2.9.0 wiki at the new Apache VM and copying
over relevant stuff from the old wiki if the license permits so.
(immediately eating our own dogfood)
Once the basic structure of the new wiki is complete, we put a clear hint
on the old wiki that is has become a sort of archive and refer/redirect to
the new wiki.
Then, we could have a look at the statistics (access.log ? pagecounts?) of
the old wiki, and decide if it is still useful.

(We could also host a new SandBox wiki in the new VM, right?)

regards,
Harry


On 2 December 2012 16:57, Glen Mazza (JIRA) <j...@apache.org> wrote:

      [
https://issues.apache.org/**jira/browse/JSPWIKI-739?page=**
com.atlassian.jira.plugin.**system.issuetabpanels:comment-**
tabpanel&focusedCommentId=**13508296#comment-13508296<https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/JSPWIKI-739?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanel&focusedCommentId=13508296#comment-13508296>
]

Glen Mazza commented on JSPWIKI-739:
------------------------------**------

I don't like Roy's answer here (from the email you cited above):

"In other words, you can just say

   Unless otherwise noted, contributions to this wiki are licensed
   to the Apache Software Foundation as contributions under the
   Apache License, version 2.0."

We're just kicking the can down the road by having licensing *other* than
Apache License, Version 2.0 on the new wiki.  Companies use the WikiText
in
their documentation and they need the comfort that it's 100%
Apache-licensed and can be freely used just like Apache source code.
Going
forward, it needs to be understood that whatever a person writes on the
Apache Wiki is immediately Apache-licensed, and if they don't like that,
then don't post any Wiki content (i.e., no "unless otherwise noted"
section
that Roy is suggesting).  I.e., we need to have a proverbial fire where
all
old records are lost so we can start anew with 100% Apache licensed
Content.

What I see here is a three-step process:
1.) Shrink jspwiki.org by deleting as many outdated or marginally useful
pages as possible.  For example, the UserList can completely go (it's out
of date and we can create a brand-new user list later), and most of the
Ongoing Discussion links predate 2010 and hence also can be removed.
This,
for example 
(http://www.jspwiki.org/wiki/**JSPWikiDependencies<http://www.jspwiki.org/wiki/JSPWikiDependencies>)
is absurdly
out of date and we should just refer people to the build.xml for those
who
need an authoritative list of that info.

2.) Go down the left-side menu, delete all pages that are already covered
by the main Apache JSPWiki page (Mailing List, documentation link, JIRA
URL, Getting Involved, etc.)  Anything there that should be on the main
Apache JSPWiki site 
(http://incubator.apache.org/**jspwiki/<http://incubator.apache.org/jspwiki/>),
either
directly add it or just make a note and we can put it there later.

3.) Move all the *factual* HOWTO material from http://www.jspwiki.org to
http://doc.jspwiki.org/2.4/ (or a new http://doc.jspwiki.org/2.9/) --
include no matter-of-opinion, random discussion, thoughts, etc.  Factual
material "2 + 3 = 5" that can't be stated any other way generally will
not
have the copyright concerns.  If there's any material we don't know who
wrote and remain concerned about moving it to http://doc.jspwiki.org, I
think it's better to just delete it and start anew, then to go forward
with
the shackles of "orphan works" (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/**
Orphan_works <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orphan_works>)
hampering the new Apache-hosted wiki.

4.) By this stage, http://www.jspwiki.org/ should have nothing on it and
can be shut down.  Instead we then discuss how to move
http://doc.jspwiki.org/2.4/ to the new Apache Wiki, with all of it 100%
Apache-owned.

I can help on #1 and #2 if desired, then we can look at what's left for
#3
before proceeding with it.


Move jspwiki.org content to ASF-owned VM
------------------------------**----------

                 Key: JSPWIKI-739
                 URL: https://issues.apache.org/**
jira/browse/JSPWIKI-739<https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/JSPWIKI-739>
             Project: JSPWiki
          Issue Type: Task
    Affects Versions: Graduating
            Reporter: Janne Jalkanen
            Assignee: Florian Holeczek
             Fix For: Graduating


jspwiki.org content needs to be moved over to ASF-hosted place.

  Apparently VMs are available.

We can either move jspwiki.org to Apache, or I can keep the domain and

point everything to jspwiki.apache.org.

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