That's no strawman, that's a genuine questionning.
You talk inclusivity, I'm all for it, but can we walk the talk now?
'They' is a bigger barrier to entry than 'he' for non-English
readers/coders. But hey, what do I know, what is my perspective here?
The stated initiative is good: the majority of users are female, the
code is male-centric, can we be progressive, inclusive... But 'they'
sucks. As I said, why not use "she" ?
I don't send formating and commenting patches, the QA team having quite
enough on its plate already.
Philippe Blouin,
Responsable du développement informatique
Tél. : (888) 604-2627
philippe.blo...@inlibro.com <mailto:philippe.blo...@inlibro.com>
inLibro | pour esprit libre | www.inLibro.com <http://www.inLibro.com>
On 04/19/2017 03:20 PM, Chris Cormack wrote:
Of course we won't fail patches, thanks for the strawman. We can
easily fix them instead. In fact I volunteer to do that.
You're welcome to fix grammar too, send some patches.
And of course you can vote -1 you just did. I certainly noticed it.
Chris
On 20 April 2017 7:16:22 AM NZST, Philippe Blouin
<philippe.blo...@inlibro.com> wrote:
My mistake, I hadn't read the original bugzilla. :-(
Well, can I -1 this or only +1 are politically acceptable? Since
this is politic, really. Could you amend the ticket to also
rewrite all the comments to some acceptable level of English, to
start with? Syntax, grammar, conjugation...
Call me obtuse, but 'they' can be quite offputting in the middle
of a sentence. I've read some short novels with that usage (used
as an androgynous pronoun). To someone whose first language is
not English, that can be quite disconcerting on first and second
read.
The ticket also refers to someone having written "it" for a person
in some comment. Well, that's the type of things that occurs in a
software partly written by French (I'm not pointing), Indians and
Finns... You want to set a rule forcing them to use proper
English, you'll fail their patches because of it, in the name of
inclusivity??? That's productive...
Frankly, a much better "rule" should have been to write all
comments using the _female_ form. Clear and concise. But I don't
believe that was the aim of the ticket...
Philippe Blouin,
Responsable du développement informatique
Tél. : (888) 604-2627
philippe.blo...@inlibro.com <mailto:philippe.blo...@inlibro.com>
inLibro | pour esprit libre | www.inLibro.com
<http://www.inLibro.com>
On 04/19/2017 02:18 PM, Jonathan Druart wrote:
The patches only affect code comments so no translation needed.
On Wed, 19 Apr 2017 at 15:12 Philippe Blouin
<philippe.blo...@inlibro.com
<mailto:philippe.blo...@inlibro.com>> wrote:
How many of "these" are there to change? Not that the work
itself will be massive, but putting a 'they' in the middle of
a sentence does not make it easy to translate intuitively, I
would think. If it's a consideration (it is for non-English
users, at least).
Philippe Blouin,
Responsable du développement informatique
Tél. : (888) 604-2627
philippe.blo...@inlibro.com <mailto:philippe.blo...@inlibro.com>
inLibro | pour esprit libre | www.inLibro.com
<http://www.inLibro.com>
On 04/19/2017 01:16 PM, Jonathan Druart wrote:
The next step would be to provide a check to our QA tests to
make sure we will not introduce future occurrences.
I am pretty sure they will not be caught manually by QAers.
On Wed, 19 Apr 2017 at 13:56 Eric Phetteplace
<ephettepl...@cca.edu <mailto:ephettepl...@cca.edu>> wrote:
Hi Paul,
English has a singular "they". It doesn't suggest
androgyny, either, from the definitions I've seen. For
instance, Oxford English Dictionary:
2. In anaphoric reference to a singular noun or pronoun
of undetermined gender: he or she.
The first usage example OED provides is from 1375. I
don't think replacing "he" with "she" addresses the
problem, it's still assuming a default gender. It's not
too much tricker to search code for he/him & replace
with they/them but that's also just an implementation
issue, not a policy one.
It sounds like people are otherwise supportive but I'm
not sure what the next step should be.
Best,
Eric Phetteplace
Systems Librarian
California College of the Arts
libraries.cca.edu <http://libraries.cca.edu> |
vault.cca.edu <http://vault.cca.edu>
510.594.3660
2>/dev/null
On Wed, Apr 19, 2017 at 8:42 AM, Paul A
<pau...@navalmarinearchive.com
<mailto:pau...@navalmarinearchive.com>> wrote:
On 2017-04-18 08:25 PM, Eric Phetteplace wrote:
Hi list,
I opened bug
[snip]
Before*:*
"Kid growing and become a juvenile, he should pay "
After:
"Kid growing and become a juvenile, they should pay "
Political correctness has never been my strong point
(although I try to understand it), but I'm
proficient in grammatical rigour. [1]
"Kid" is a singular noun, "a" is a singular article
-- "they" is a plural pronoun. Perhaps replace
"they" with "[s]he"? or "Kids growing and becoming
juveniles, they should pay"?
From a code maintenance p.o.v., it's easier to find
and replace 'he' with '[s]he' if really this becomes
a priority for Koha.
Best -- Paul
[1] I am aware of the so-called "singular third
person epicene 'they'", but academically object to
it -- it often suggests androgyny rather than gender
neutrality.
_______________________________________________
Koha-devel mailing list
Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org
<mailto:Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org>
http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
website : http://www.koha-community.org/
git : http://git.koha-community.org/
bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
_______________________________________________
Koha-devel mailing list
Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org
<mailto:Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org>
http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
website : http://www.koha-community.org/
git : http://git.koha-community.org/
bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
_______________________________________________
Koha-devel mailing list
Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org
<mailto:Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org>
http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
website :http://www.koha-community.org/
git :http://git.koha-community.org/
bugs :http://bugs.koha-community.org/
_______________________________________________
Koha-devel mailing list
Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org
<mailto:Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org>
http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
website : http://www.koha-community.org/
git : http://git.koha-community.org/
bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
_______________________________________________
Koha-devel mailing list
Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org
http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
website :http://www.koha-community.org/
git :http://git.koha-community.org/
bugs :http://bugs.koha-community.org/
--
Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.
_______________________________________________
Koha-devel mailing list
Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org
http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
website : http://www.koha-community.org/
git : http://git.koha-community.org/
bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
