On Mon, Sep 25, 2006 at 01:13:39PM -0700, Paul G. Allen wrote: > So, John, Lan, and anyone else, what is the answer to competing with > manufacturing markets that basically have forced and child labor? What do > we do to compete when we (the US, other countries as well) have laws that > prevent certain unfair or downright immoral business and labor practices > where foreign countries (such as China) do not? Such countries are able to > undercut our labor rates by such an extent that there is absolutely no way > to compete. (NOTE: I've seen numerous hearings and investigations into many > corporations - Nike and Wal Mart to name just two - that have shown these > practices to be very wide spread.)
A truly open, free market is not a warm, cuddly place. The quest to slash costs and increase margins can, and does, lead to situations like that. But the quality is not going to be comparable to that of goods produced by skilled, willing workers. > How do we keep manufacturing jobs in this country when it's so damn cheap > to mfg. elsewhere? We don't. If it's cheaper to produce goods somewhere else, than the free market determines that that's where they're going to be made. We can adapt and innovate, or die... a free market isn't "fair" in that everyone gets a nice comfy life. Yout get a "fair" chance to keep working for a nice comfy life. Yes, I know the next problem... "What do we do when we don't manufacture anything any more, and we're beholden to overseas interests for everything?" We either meet their price, or we start manufacturing stuff ourselves again. In the short term, yes, there could be misery, massive unemployment, starvation, whathaveyou. But in the long run it'll always work out, one way or another. > If there were no incentives to have goods manufactured off shore, or buy > foreign goods, then maybe we'd keep more of those types of jobs in the US. Maybe. But why do we in the US have some special "right" to keep certain jobs around? It's arguably in our interest, in the short term. But what do we do when we insist that Product X must be made in America by American laborers, but then turn around and insist that those American laborers must receive an "American" wage, bennies, working conditions, retirement, etc? Product X becomes a lot more expensive, that's what. We then have the choice... grin and bear it, or try to put up walls between us and competing, cheaper Product X's. In either case, there will be a demand for the cheaper Product X, and we now have smuggling and a black market to fill that demand. You cannot beat the open market. Many have tried, all have failed. The economy of Soviet Russia came to depend upon the black market, because their strict command economy couldn't fill any of the basic demands of their society. > On the other hand, how do we force other countries to impose stiffer labor > laws so that people are not exploited and produces a more fair playing > ground? Force them? Well, we can refuse to buy from them. But that suggests that everyone is willing to stand up for that principle and not succumb to buying their goods. As long as their product is significantly cheaper than the same product produced under conditions we approve of, we're back to the whole black market problem. We could also go to war with them. That's a time-honored way of making other people behave as you'd like them to, rather than how they would like to. The answer to this whole issue that would result in a solution you would find to be acceptable, is "Change human nature". That isn't too likely. So, we have to deal with the world as it is, not as we wish it were. -- *********************************************************************** * John Oliver http://www.john-oliver.net/ * * * *********************************************************************** -- [email protected] http://www.kernel-panic.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/kplug-list
