On Fri, Jan 8, 2016 at 4:32 AM, ledger-smb-users < ledger-smb-us...@infopower.nl> wrote:
> > I appreciate your sensitivity on this but in the context of this > > discussion, but in this context, feel free to discuss it. > > Good. It is ledger-cli. Written in C, and working surprisingly fast, it > has a command line interface although there's also a fork, hledger, > which can work with a browser GUI. > I have looked at Ledger-CLI because it was chosen as the basis for an open source non-profit-oriented solution. It is well done for what it does. One of the impressions that I got from it was that the direction we are moving, in the area of a clear separation of mechanism from interface, is a good one and that is one thing that LedgerCLI does very well (making it a very good for very small operations). > > It maintains a 'database' in text format with different files for > payors/payees and for their commodities and their prices if you like to > maintain those, and for the accounts of course. it's all plain readable > and relations between the > entities are clear and can easily be tracked down if needed. > Right. It has to lock that so no concurrent access right? I mean you can have a server which serializes requests and enters them one at a time, but you cannot have multiple readers and multiple writers at the same moment, as I understand it. So the design limitations are different. If it works for you I won't be the one to bad mouth them or anything. It's a good program for what it does. However it is worth noting what we can learn from them. > > Inputting is very fast and for repeating transactions you simple do a > search/copy/paste in your text document and change the date. > I wonder how hard it woudl be to make a ledger-cli-compatible import library for LSMB. Not sure we could do the same tagging they do (our tagging system is different) but for basic format stuff should be easy I think. I will add an enhancement item to do this. > > If the commodity's price has changed you put a new, time stamped, entry > in the price list. > > It's not for people who have no clue of computers and are only windows > GUI users, but for people like me, with some basic (and then some more) > understanding of computers it's very useable. > > Reporting is quite comprehensive yet not straight forward, but here my > litlle bit more-than-basic understanding of computers plays out quite > well. Not to mention the free (as in free beer) support on the forum, > irc channel where the main developer chimes in on a regular basis. > > Install is not straight forward but much less complicated than lsmb was. > > It's not an ERP but that's not what I need. > > I just need the expenses, income, stocks (oh, it does handle those also > in an elegant manner--no 'warehouses' though), sales and > receivables/payables and the reporting thereof, on a project basis. > > If you remember (it's years ago) the project based reporting was my > main reason for starting with LSMB, but with ledger-cli that's covered > as well now. > > However, before I leave this world, which won't be anytime soon if it > were up to me, I'm sure I'll have to go back to something like LSMB for > my successors to be able to continue the things I'm doing now with > ledger, so I'm still interested in the developments. > Hence my continued subscription to this list. :) > Thanks again for the discussion here. It is worth seeing what we can learn from them as well. Best Wishes, Chris Travers > > > > > > After all, we can't be everything to everybody, which means it's > > > > definitely good to have alternatives to point people to. > > > > > > Right, it's no problem. > > > > > > > > By now probably things have changed in LSMB in that maybe there > > > > > is a confirmation step now, but I'm sure I would find another > > > > > way to do something seriously damaging to the database. > > > > > > > > > > > > > Actually, it would be very helpful, if you did that :-) > > > > > > Your sense of humour is appreciated. :) > > > > > > > Actually almost every time we have seen this, it has prompted database > > fixes, so seriously..... > > > > > > > > > > Then there was the install procedure which was really some > > > > > excercise in self-torture for a diy-er... I'm happy to hear that > > > > > things are going to improve, or already have. > > > > > > > > > > > > > Right. There's a direct relation between this point and the > > > > incorporation of Efficito, which offers a hosted solution: > > > > there's a direct relationship between the complexity of the setup > > > > procedure and the desire to be not only an accounting system, but > > > > also to integrate invoicing, with PDF invoices, open item > > > > management, inventory management, fixed assets administration and > > > > so on, with the ability to mail customers and vendors directly > > > > from inside the system. (Although, granted, most users probably > > > > most heavily use the accounting side.) > > > > > > I sense a tiny amount of friction here with the open source model if > > > not 'home use' but understand the rationale. > > > > > > > Well, Erik's sentence above covers a breathtaking scope in terms of > > what we actually offer. > > Yes, and it's the combination of you offering an open source solution > as well running a business based on it which made me hesitating > mentioning the other sulution that I'm using now. > > > The setup complexity for a basic system for a given industry will > > eventually get solved for some definition of "setup." THis could be > > done with vms or docker images, or better packaging. > > With 'better' packaging you probably mean 'faster'? I agree. > VM Appliances would be an option, but not for me as I'm using Qubes OS, > but Docker images could work also. > > > But if I > > understand Erik's points above that's a minority really of what we > > are talking about. > > > > First, people will want some new templates or the like. Some of this > > can be improved as well. But design is design and that is not > > something you can just drop in regardless of the technology used. > > > > But then we have things which are "setup" issues but are their own > > disciplines. If you are slightly larger, how do you tune > > PostgreSQL? Do you want backups? An ability to restore to a point > > in time if something goes badly? Where are these stored? Want > > replication? What then? > > With the ledger-cli I'm using git for that. :) > > > Then we get to emailing invoices. > > No need for that. > > > Here anti-spam best practices have > > changed a lot in the last decade Do you want to keep up with that? > > No. > > > Then there are other aspects. Do you want training? > > No. > > > Or is > > documentation and the email lists good enough? > > If comprehensive enough: Yes. > > > What about on-going > > support? > > Well, of course. :) > > > There are a lot of people for whom these extra burdens of running a > > system are really not very attractive. That is effectively where > > Efficito comes in. > > Fully understood. > > > Are we the only vendor here? No. > > Do we want to be the only vendor here? No. > > Do we want people to run LSMB at home? Yes. > > Are we here to help? Yes. > > > > > > > > > > Thanks for introducing me to accounting however, I learned a > > > > > lot of this experience.- > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks again for following up on your original feedback! Happy and > > > > prosperous 2016! > > > > > > And to you too. > > > > > > > Thanks again! > > You're welcome. Thanks for the elaborate reply. > > > ario > > > > > > > > > ario > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Ledger-smb-users mailing list > > > Ledger-smb-users@lists.sourceforge.net > > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/ledger-smb-users > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > _______________________________________________ > Ledger-smb-users mailing list > Ledger-smb-users@lists.sourceforge.net > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/ledger-smb-users > -- Best Wishes, Chris Travers Efficito: Hosted Accounting and ERP. Robust and Flexible. No vendor lock-in. http://www.efficito.com/learn_more
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